I want to push back against this kind of explicit engagement in partisan politics, but I feel like that’s probably a losing battle while Trump is around. Can we at least have a consensus and commitment that we go back to the previous norm after this election, to prevent a slippery slope where engaging in partisan politics becomes increasingly acceptable in EA?
Wei, I feel that I addressed this in the final paragraph of the article. From my perspective, it’s pretty simple: EA values are EA values and partisan values are partisan values. So long as EA and partisan values happen to be in alignment, it’s both natural and desirable for there to be an alliance between them. So I agree with you on the notion of maintaining them as separate concepts, but I personally would like to see as much engagement in politics (not just in the US, but around the world) by/within EA as is warranted by the alignment I mentioned, no more or no less.
To me, this feels completely straightforward and not threatening at all, so I am curious to understand better why it makes you uncomfortable. Is it that:
You don’t agree that EA should be involved in partisan politics even in cases when there is very strong alignment between the movement and one party/coalition or very strong misalignment with an opposing party/coalition?
You disagree with the premise that Trump’s leadership is very strongly misaligned with EA values?
Something else?
I very much appreciate your willingness to explore this further.
In general, partisan politics is far from neglected and therefore unlikely to be the most effective use of altruistic resources.
Partisan politics is very tempting for people to engage in, due to basic human nature, hence the risk of a slippery slope.
It’s very hard to avoid bias when thinking/talking about partisan politics, both as individuals and as a community. For example, in many social circles, defending Trump on any aspect can cause someone to be branded as a racist, to be shunned, even to lose their livelihood (or at least to lose social status/prestige). A community that is considered insufficiently opposed to Trump can come to be seen as “toxic” and shunned by other communities that it has to interact with. Under these circumstances, open and reasoned debate becomes impossible, and one can easily come to believe that “EA and partisan values happen to be in alignment” to a much higher degree than is actually the case.
I agree with #1 as well, but think you’re conflating “unlikely” with “never.” It’s possible for cause areas to be high-profile and still be among the highest and best uses of one’s resources. That’s because neglectedness is only one of three considerations in the ITN framework, and a core (if implicit) premise of the post is that this particular election is both enormously important and highly tractable.
On #3, it sounds like you’re disputing the notion that EA and Trump are misaligned here but are reluctant to say why. I’m happy for you to message me privately about this if you prefer. I do note that in the 2019 EA Survey less than 1% of respondents identified as right-wing, which I take to be very strong evidence of the misalignment I mentioned, at least as perceived by rank-and-file community members.
Question for you (and others who have had skeptical reactions to this post): would you be comfortable with there being a formal process to determine when political engagement under the “EA brand” is appropriate/encouraged? For example, there could be a council of trusted movement leaders to make such determinations, like the group that decides when community members are banned (I can’t remember what they are called, sorry). Or there could be some kind of referendum system.
Can we at least have a consensus and commitment that we go back to the previous norm after this election, to prevent a slippery slope where engaging in partisan politics becomes increasingly acceptable in EA?
Unfortunately I expect that in four years time partisans will decide that 2024 is the new most important election in history and hence would renege on any such agreement.
Could you say more about what you want to achieve, and why? I can’t tell from your comment whether you are opposed to all political engagement in general, or only under conditions that are currently not met, and I would like to understand your reasoning. What risks are you concerned about? How do you decide when the circumstances are appropriate for political engagement?
I want to push back against this kind of explicit engagement in partisan politics, but I feel like that’s probably a losing battle while Trump is around. Can we at least have a consensus and commitment that we go back to the previous norm after this election, to prevent a slippery slope where engaging in partisan politics becomes increasingly acceptable in EA?
Wei, I feel that I addressed this in the final paragraph of the article. From my perspective, it’s pretty simple: EA values are EA values and partisan values are partisan values. So long as EA and partisan values happen to be in alignment, it’s both natural and desirable for there to be an alliance between them. So I agree with you on the notion of maintaining them as separate concepts, but I personally would like to see as much engagement in politics (not just in the US, but around the world) by/within EA as is warranted by the alignment I mentioned, no more or no less.
To me, this feels completely straightforward and not threatening at all, so I am curious to understand better why it makes you uncomfortable. Is it that:
You don’t agree that EA should be involved in partisan politics even in cases when there is very strong alignment between the movement and one party/coalition or very strong misalignment with an opposing party/coalition?
You disagree with the premise that Trump’s leadership is very strongly misaligned with EA values?
Something else?
I very much appreciate your willingness to explore this further.
In general, partisan politics is far from neglected and therefore unlikely to be the most effective use of altruistic resources.
Partisan politics is very tempting for people to engage in, due to basic human nature, hence the risk of a slippery slope.
It’s very hard to avoid bias when thinking/talking about partisan politics, both as individuals and as a community. For example, in many social circles, defending Trump on any aspect can cause someone to be branded as a racist, to be shunned, even to lose their livelihood (or at least to lose social status/prestige). A community that is considered insufficiently opposed to Trump can come to be seen as “toxic” and shunned by other communities that it has to interact with. Under these circumstances, open and reasoned debate becomes impossible, and one can easily come to believe that “EA and partisan values happen to be in alignment” to a much higher degree than is actually the case.
Thanks for responding. A few quick thoughts:
I agree with you on #2.
I agree with #1 as well, but think you’re conflating “unlikely” with “never.” It’s possible for cause areas to be high-profile and still be among the highest and best uses of one’s resources. That’s because neglectedness is only one of three considerations in the ITN framework, and a core (if implicit) premise of the post is that this particular election is both enormously important and highly tractable.
On #3, it sounds like you’re disputing the notion that EA and Trump are misaligned here but are reluctant to say why. I’m happy for you to message me privately about this if you prefer. I do note that in the 2019 EA Survey less than 1% of respondents identified as right-wing, which I take to be very strong evidence of the misalignment I mentioned, at least as perceived by rank-and-file community members.
Question for you (and others who have had skeptical reactions to this post): would you be comfortable with there being a formal process to determine when political engagement under the “EA brand” is appropriate/encouraged? For example, there could be a council of trusted movement leaders to make such determinations, like the group that decides when community members are banned (I can’t remember what they are called, sorry). Or there could be some kind of referendum system.
Unfortunately I expect that in four years time partisans will decide that 2024 is the new most important election in history and hence would renege on any such agreement.
Larks, I have no idea what 2024 will bring, but I can assure you that I would not have made this pitch to the EA community over the 2012 election.
Could you say more about what you want to achieve, and why? I can’t tell from your comment whether you are opposed to all political engagement in general, or only under conditions that are currently not met, and I would like to understand your reasoning. What risks are you concerned about? How do you decide when the circumstances are appropriate for political engagement?