Thanks for contributing to one of the most important meta-EA discussions going on right now (c.f. this similar post)! I agree that there should be splinter movements that revolve around different purposes (e.g., x-risk reduction, effective giving) but I disagree that EA is no longer accurately described by ‘effective altruism,’ and so I disagree that EA should be renamed or that it should focus on “people who want to help the less fortunate (humans or animals) to the best of their abilities, without anyone trying to be convince them that protecting the far future is the most altruistic cause area.” I think this because
The core pitch still gets you to effective giving and longtermism. I think the core pitch for EA is not “We have high-quality evidence to show that some charities are orders of magnitude more effective than others. If you want do the most good with your money, you should find organizations that are seen and measured to be high impact by reputed organizations like GiveWell,” but rather, using evidence & reason to maximize good ➡️ the scale/tractability/neglectedness framework.
This easily gets you to effective giving (cause prioritization + finding cost-effective interventions) but can also get you to longtermism. For an example pitch that does both, see UChicago’s 2021 info presentation.
Of course, this might not be the right pitch for everyone! It seems reasonable that workplace groups might focus more on effective giving—but doing so would, I expect, make it harder to shift towards longtermism than the broader and more philosophical core pitch.
EA appeals to a specific, distinct audience that isn’t captured by a movement that is solely focused on existential risk or more near-term causes. Insofar as EA aspires to be a question, not an ideology, convening people who are interested in taking the fundamental assumptions of EA (cause prioritization etc.) and applying them to social impact seems crucial for sustainably finding answers to the question of, “how do we do the most good?” Without an umbrella movement, I would be concerned that it would be less likely that people with different knowledge and experiences would exchange ideas on how to do good, making it less likely that any given community would be able to quickly adapt to how priorities shift as the world changes.
While EA might not be the best name or acronym, I think it does a decent job of capturing the underlying principles: prioritizing so we can be most effective when we aim to act altruistically.
I also think that EA community builders are doing a decent job of creating alternative pipelines, similar to your proposal for creating an x-risk movement. For example,
GWWC’s 2022 strategy, which revolves around the effective giving frame that still works as a great intro (or end-point!) for potential members of EA
There’s still a lot more work to be done but I’m optimistic that we can create sub-movements without completely rebranding or shifting the EA movement away from longtermist causes!
Thanks for contributing to one of the most important meta-EA discussions going on right now (c.f. this similar post)! I agree that there should be splinter movements that revolve around different purposes (e.g., x-risk reduction, effective giving) but I disagree that EA is no longer accurately described by ‘effective altruism,’ and so I disagree that EA should be renamed or that it should focus on “people who want to help the less fortunate (humans or animals) to the best of their abilities, without anyone trying to be convince them that protecting the far future is the most altruistic cause area.” I think this because
The core pitch still gets you to effective giving and longtermism. I think the core pitch for EA is not “We have high-quality evidence to show that some charities are orders of magnitude more effective than others. If you want do the most good with your money, you should find organizations that are seen and measured to be high impact by reputed organizations like GiveWell,” but rather, using evidence & reason to maximize good ➡️ the scale/tractability/neglectedness framework.
This easily gets you to effective giving (cause prioritization + finding cost-effective interventions) but can also get you to longtermism. For an example pitch that does both, see UChicago’s 2021 info presentation.
Of course, this might not be the right pitch for everyone! It seems reasonable that workplace groups might focus more on effective giving—but doing so would, I expect, make it harder to shift towards longtermism than the broader and more philosophical core pitch.
EA appeals to a specific, distinct audience that isn’t captured by a movement that is solely focused on existential risk or more near-term causes. Insofar as EA aspires to be a question, not an ideology, convening people who are interested in taking the fundamental assumptions of EA (cause prioritization etc.) and applying them to social impact seems crucial for sustainably finding answers to the question of, “how do we do the most good?” Without an umbrella movement, I would be concerned that it would be less likely that people with different knowledge and experiences would exchange ideas on how to do good, making it less likely that any given community would be able to quickly adapt to how priorities shift as the world changes.
While EA might not be the best name or acronym, I think it does a decent job of capturing the underlying principles: prioritizing so we can be most effective when we aim to act altruistically.
I also think that EA community builders are doing a decent job of creating alternative pipelines, similar to your proposal for creating an x-risk movement. For example,
Using different framings: Simplify EA Pitches to “Holy Shit, X-Risk” ➡️ “Holy Shit, X-risk” talk
Running x-risk specific retreats (e.g. GCP)
Creating x-risk or cause-specific groups (e.g. Harvard-MIT X-Risk, AI safety university groups)
GWWC’s 2022 strategy, which revolves around the effective giving frame that still works as a great intro (or end-point!) for potential members of EA
There’s still a lot more work to be done but I’m optimistic that we can create sub-movements without completely rebranding or shifting the EA movement away from longtermist causes!