[Edit: now I have more agreement with @Jason that the internal systems need work. I’m personally still impressed by the CH team’s work and don’t want people to believe official EA avenues are fundamentally broken or anything, but yes there is greater need for internal improvement than I thought. See @Lauren Maria ’s response to me below]
Fair points. Well, I don’t necessarily agree that the “internal mechanisms to listen to these individuals” needs work, as I think that there are current avenues to know that SA in EA was being handled or plans were being made for things to be handled, and/or ways to find out that one’s case was not the fault of EA or even performed by an EA man (before reporting it to Time with claim of such). But the proof is in the pudding that these were not publicized or promoted enough.
So I do agree (and have written elsewhere) that EA dropped the ball on announcing intention to make changes (and changes made) in response to SA complaints back in November. It is understandable that some women felt they needed another step. We don’t know that any complainants would have been paying enough attention to notice announcements, but I bet at least some would have, and the Time journalist could have noticed at least.
And FWIW I strong-agreed with another comment you wrote elsewhere that we need a solid list of criteria for who is and is not an EA, because we also need to be able to clearly name cases that are within EA jurisdiction and which EAs have the ability to handle vs those which are not. So that resentment doesn’t build toward EA in cases where it is not warranted.
Well, I don’t necessarily agree that the “internal mechanisms to listen to these individuals” needs work, as I think that there are current avenues to know that SA in EA was being handled or plans were being made for things to be handled, and/or ways to find out that one’s case was not the fault of EA or even performed by an EA man (before reporting it to Time with claim of such)
I think we can say that it does need work, based on these recent posts, and the CEA team seems to be acknowledging this (which is great!).
In reference to your previous conversation with Jason, It also seems that these people going to the press may have actually encouraged the CEA to have an external investigation and for Owen Cotton-Barratt to step down.
[Edit: now I have more agreement with @Jason that the internal systems need work. I’m personally still impressed by the CH team’s work and don’t want people to believe official EA avenues are fundamentally broken or anything, but yes there is greater need for internal improvement than I thought. See @Lauren Maria ’s response to me below]
Fair points. Well, I don’t necessarily agree that the “internal mechanisms to listen to these individuals” needs work, as I think that there are current avenues to know that SA in EA was being handled or plans were being made for things to be handled, and/or ways to find out that one’s case was not the fault of EA or even performed by an EA man (before reporting it to Time with claim of such). But the proof is in the pudding that these were not publicized or promoted enough.
So I do agree (and have written elsewhere) that EA dropped the ball on announcing intention to make changes (and changes made) in response to SA complaints back in November. It is understandable that some women felt they needed another step. We don’t know that any complainants would have been paying enough attention to notice announcements, but I bet at least some would have, and the Time journalist could have noticed at least.
And FWIW I strong-agreed with another comment you wrote elsewhere that we need a solid list of criteria for who is and is not an EA, because we also need to be able to clearly name cases that are within EA jurisdiction and which EAs have the ability to handle vs those which are not. So that resentment doesn’t build toward EA in cases where it is not warranted.
I think we can say that it does need work, based on these recent posts, and the CEA team seems to be acknowledging this (which is great!).
In reference to your previous conversation with Jason, It also seems that these people going to the press may have actually encouraged the CEA to have an external investigation and for Owen Cotton-Barratt to step down.
Yeah I def think you and Jason are more right now than I did even a few hours ago. Edited.