I don’t think (or, you have not convinced me that) it’s appropriate to use CEA’s actions as strong evidence against Jacy. There are many obvious pragmatic justifications to do so that are only slightly related to the factual basis of the allegations—I.e., even if the allegations are unsubstantiated, the safest option for a large organization like CEA would be to cut ties with him regardless. Furthermore, saying someone has “incentives to lie” about their own defense also feels inappropriate (with some exceptions/caveats), since that basically applies to almost every situation where someone has been accused.
The main thing that you mentioned which seems relevant is his “documented history of lying,” which (I say this in a neutral rather than accusatory way) I haven’t yet seen documentation of.
Ultimately, these accusations are concerning, but I’m also quite concerned of the idea of throwing around seemingly dubious arguments in service of vilifying someone.
It is bizarre to say that the aforementioned evidence is not strong evidence against Jacy. He was thrown out of university for sexual misconduct. CEA then completely disassociated itself from him because of sexual misconduct several years later. Multiple people at multiple different times in his life have accused him of sexual misconduct.
I think we are agreed that he has incentives to lie. He has also shown that he is a liar.
If you’re referring to the same point about his claim to be a cofounder, I did just see that. However, unless I see some additional and/or more-egregious quotes from Jacy, I have a fairly negative evaluation of your accusation. Perhaps his claim was a bit exaggerative combined with being easily misinterpreted, but it seems he has walked it back.
Ultimately, this really does not qualify in my mind as “a history of lying.”
You could also read the entirety of the research he produced for ACE, which it would be fair to describe as ‘comprised entirely of bullshit’.
To stress, it is completely ludicrous for him to claim that he is a co-founder of effective altruism, unless he interpreted the claim to be true of like Sasha Cooper or Pablo Stafforini. They would never say that they are founders of effective altruism because it is not true and they are not sociopaths (like Jacy is).
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I don’t think (or, you have not convinced me that) it’s appropriate to use CEA’s actions as strong evidence against Jacy. There are many obvious pragmatic justifications to do so that are only slightly related to the factual basis of the allegations—I.e., even if the allegations are unsubstantiated, the safest option for a large organization like CEA would be to cut ties with him regardless. Furthermore, saying someone has “incentives to lie” about their own defense also feels inappropriate (with some exceptions/caveats), since that basically applies to almost every situation where someone has been accused. The main thing that you mentioned which seems relevant is his “documented history of lying,” which (I say this in a neutral rather than accusatory way) I haven’t yet seen documentation of.
Ultimately, these accusations are concerning, but I’m also quite concerned of the idea of throwing around seemingly dubious arguments in service of vilifying someone.
It is bizarre to say that the aforementioned evidence is not strong evidence against Jacy. He was thrown out of university for sexual misconduct. CEA then completely disassociated itself from him because of sexual misconduct several years later. Multiple people at multiple different times in his life have accused him of sexual misconduct.
I think we are agreed that he has incentives to lie. He has also shown that he is a liar.
on his history of lying. https://nonprofitchronicles.com/2019/04/02/the-peculiar-metoo-story-of-animal-activist-jacy-reese/
Please provide specific quotes, I spent a few minutes reading the first part of that without seeing what you were referring to
If you’re referring to the same point about his claim to be a cofounder, I did just see that. However, unless I see some additional and/or more-egregious quotes from Jacy, I have a fairly negative evaluation of your accusation. Perhaps his claim was a bit exaggerative combined with being easily misinterpreted, but it seems he has walked it back. Ultimately, this really does not qualify in my mind as “a history of lying.”
You could also read the entirety of the research he produced for ACE, which it would be fair to describe as ‘comprised entirely of bullshit’.
To stress, it is completely ludicrous for him to claim that he is a co-founder of effective altruism, unless he interpreted the claim to be true of like Sasha Cooper or Pablo Stafforini. They would never say that they are founders of effective altruism because it is not true and they are not sociopaths (like Jacy is).
Some comments in this thread are uncivil and break Forum norms. The moderation team is asking John Halstead to refrain from adding more to this thread.
I’m not vilifying the guy. His actions have done that for him and I have just described his actions.