I’m surprised you were putting such high odds on it being a mistake at this point (even before the arrest). From my understanding (all public info), FTX’s terms of service agreed that they would not touch customer funds. But then FTX loaned those funds to Alameda, who made risky bets with them.
IANAL but this seems to me like pretty clear case of fraud from FTX. I didn’t think any of those aspects of the story were really disputed, but I have not been following the story as closely in the past week or so.
Likewise. At some point I had looked into using FTX for crypto. I didn’t because it raised several red flags for me, but let me share my recollections about the historical ToS, fwiw:
Wayne, I see in another post you aren’t sure what about its terms of service was violated. I can’t pull up the historical ToS, and I’m not sure if they changed, but back when I looked into using it, I specifically looked for language that they were keeping the funds safe and not lending them out and I found that language. If the language somehow wasn’t completely airtight, it was at least sure as hell deceptive, because I was specifically looking for it, carefully reading it, and believed I found it. I was not interested in any tokens providing interest, so it’s also not right to (as per your post on another thread) suggest that investors should have known better because where did they think the interest was coming from. The tokens bearing interest were a separate product, as it were, and I don’t even remember seeing anything about interest. Probably the majority of users were only looking for a place to transfer money to and buy bitcoin, nothing fancier like staking. I do recall coming across instructions to wire to Alameda and saying hell no and stopping right there. I only regret not making the connection between “red flag for me” → “red flag for EA”. I did not know about the EA connection until much later (or I might have trusted Alameda).
I’m surprised you were putting such high odds on it being a mistake at this point (even before the arrest). From my understanding (all public info), FTX’s terms of service agreed that they would not touch customer funds. But then FTX loaned those funds to Alameda, who made risky bets with them.
IANAL but this seems to me like pretty clear case of fraud from FTX. I didn’t think any of those aspects of the story were really disputed, but I have not been following the story as closely in the past week or so.
Likewise. At some point I had looked into using FTX for crypto. I didn’t because it raised several red flags for me, but let me share my recollections about the historical ToS, fwiw:
Wayne, I see in another post you aren’t sure what about its terms of service was violated. I can’t pull up the historical ToS, and I’m not sure if they changed, but back when I looked into using it, I specifically looked for language that they were keeping the funds safe and not lending them out and I found that language. If the language somehow wasn’t completely airtight, it was at least sure as hell deceptive, because I was specifically looking for it, carefully reading it, and believed I found it. I was not interested in any tokens providing interest, so it’s also not right to (as per your post on another thread) suggest that investors should have known better because where did they think the interest was coming from. The tokens bearing interest were a separate product, as it were, and I don’t even remember seeing anything about interest. Probably the majority of users were only looking for a place to transfer money to and buy bitcoin, nothing fancier like staking. I do recall coming across instructions to wire to Alameda and saying hell no and stopping right there. I only regret not making the connection between “red flag for me” → “red flag for EA”. I did not know about the EA connection until much later (or I might have trusted Alameda).
Allegedly made risky bets. I think there is very real possibility the money was just stolen and siphoned into the underworld