Why Have Effective Altruists Neglected Interfacing With Religion?
What’s great about religion is that it’s full of the altruism, but it’s unknown how religion considers effectiveness. I by no means mean that religions are inherently opposed to effectiveness, or even indifferent to it. Religion has played a fundamental role in institutionalizing the very idea of charity. Religiously oriented charities individually run the gamut from effective to ineffective, and I believe that’s more due to the individual organization rather than the religion in question itself. Indeed, it’s the history of trying new charitable interventions inspired by religion that has given humanity a starting place to think about the effectiveness of altruism in the first place.
Historically, religion has implemented altruism without always thinking in terms of effectiveness, because the body of strategies composing effectiveness as an idea was abstract and unknown. It seems without its frame of mind, effective altruism is unsure how to interface with religion.
Another issue is religions tend to be deontological in nature, and while effective altruism accepts deontologists, it wasn’t designed with deontology as the primary framework in mind. So, bridging the epistemic gap between religion and effective altruism may thus be more difficult.
Anyway, I think we could make open calls to effective altruists who:
are religious
were once religious, and feel effective altruism is congruent with their religiously motivated altruism
have received positive feedback from religious folks.
so effective altruism knows better how to reach out to religion.
I am a committed Christian also committed to the principles of effective altruism. I am very frustrated with the level of apathy in the church, given that we are all called to tithe 10% of our income, like the rest of the population Christians have really lost sight of how rich they are now. I am also frustrated by the focus on differences between religions, and between religion and the non religious, when common values of love and concern for our planet giving how utterly amazing it is we are here should prevail. Altruism is at the heart of Christianity and of course it should be effective. I would be happy to work with other EAs in develop an outreach/link strategy into churches.
My wife is head of fundraising for a charity that is like a mini version of Christian aid—donating to poverty alleviating projects in a Christian context. Making this more effective would be a good place to start.
1 billion Christians should be able to make a real dent in the problems of the world if they focussed less on the coffee rota and more on what our faith actually calls us to do.
That’s great, David, and you’re the sort of person I mentioned above. Extending love, compassion, and understanding is a cornerstone of all altruism. I don’t have anything to add now, but I’ll contact you in the future if I broach this topic again.
You might be interested in this chapter on global poverty, utilitarianism, Christian ethics and Peter Singer that I wrote for a Cambridge University Press volume.
I would love to see some action in this space. I think there is a natural harmony between what is best in Christianity—especially regarding helping the global poor—and effective altruism.
One person to consider speaking with is Charlie Camosy, who has worked with Peter Singer in the past (see info here). A couple other people to consider talking with would be Catriona Mackay and Alex Foster.
David, which sort of material you think could be persuasive to the higher ecclesiastical orders so that their charity was more focused on Givewell recommended charities and similar sort of evidence based, calculation based giving?
How can we get priests to talk about the child in the pond to the faithful, in a scaleable and tractable manner?
Religion also often encourages (or is used to defend) speciesism, and it also leads many people to not believe in x-risk. As such, religious EAs are mostly only relevant to 2⁄3 of the major cause areas of EA. Given that I think global poverty is by far the least important of these cause areas, convincing religious people to care about EA doesn’t seem to have very high value to me.
X-risk and animal welfare are still pretty marginalized across the entire population, not just among the religious—and Christians have a very convenient existing infrastructure for collecting money. It might be that there are other reasons not to worry too much about them (e.g. an unmovable hierarchy that controls where the money goes), but their lack of concern for some (or even most) EA target causes doesn’t seem like it should bear much weight.
I think you overlook the strongest argument for spreading religion, namely that by converting people to the One True Faith, we could save them from eternal damnation. As eternity is a long time and damnation is very bad, this would be extremely high QALYs.
Most EAs think all religions are false, so do not subscribe to this argument. However, I do not think religious EAs can avoid this so easily. If you are a Christian EA you should probably try much harder to convert people to Christianity.
My above comment was reasons why effective altruists have found difficulty in reaching out to religion, even though it’s important because much altruism in the world is religiously motivated. However, I understand your point. If someone’s greatest priority is getting others into Heaven by converting them to their own religion, that may be a confounding factor for getting them to do other things.
However, this isn’t the case for all religious people.
How much a religious adherent is supposed to proselytize varies among sects within religions.
From what I know of major world religions, such as Islam, and Christianity, charity is emphasized as an important virtue to act upon independently of, and in addition to, converting others. The moral imperative for charity in religion tends to extend beyond helping only the less fortunate of one’s own religion.
Humans tend to signal their association with an ideology by committing to the goals set out for its adherents. When the goal seems far away, it’s easy for people to promise to achieve it. When the goal is very nearby, its difficulty becomes more apparent, and more people will shirk it. This is called construal-level theory. If you accept that model, I believe it extend to religious conversion. (Some) religious leaders will call upon their followers to convert the unbelieving, yet everyday those same followers fail to confront their neighbors, friends, families, and colleagues from believing differently. As the world becomes more globally interdependent, lots will realize the value in helping and cooperating with groups of outsiders, and their unfortunate.
Religion blends with other cultural forces in people’s lives to cause a diverse array of how they practice, and that still allows effective altruism for millions of religious folks.
Yes, I basically agree. But I think you have slightly misunderstand my argument. Many religions say both
1) You should convert people
2) You should help people
Obviously not all religions say these (for example Judaism is not very evangelical). My argument isn’t that religious people should proletize because of 2). My argument is that, given religious people’s other beliefs about heaven and hell, they should proletize because that is the most effective way of helping people. Even if their religion included no evangelical commandments, they should try to convert people as the most effective way of loving their neighbors. A secular EA charity might try to persuade people in the less economically developed countries to purify their water; a religious EA charity might try to persuade people in the developing world to say their hail marys.
Why Have Effective Altruists Neglected Interfacing With Religion?
What’s great about religion is that it’s full of the altruism, but it’s unknown how religion considers effectiveness. I by no means mean that religions are inherently opposed to effectiveness, or even indifferent to it. Religion has played a fundamental role in institutionalizing the very idea of charity. Religiously oriented charities individually run the gamut from effective to ineffective, and I believe that’s more due to the individual organization rather than the religion in question itself. Indeed, it’s the history of trying new charitable interventions inspired by religion that has given humanity a starting place to think about the effectiveness of altruism in the first place.
Historically, religion has implemented altruism without always thinking in terms of effectiveness, because the body of strategies composing effectiveness as an idea was abstract and unknown. It seems without its frame of mind, effective altruism is unsure how to interface with religion.
Another issue is religions tend to be deontological in nature, and while effective altruism accepts deontologists, it wasn’t designed with deontology as the primary framework in mind. So, bridging the epistemic gap between religion and effective altruism may thus be more difficult.
Anyway, I think we could make open calls to effective altruists who:
are religious
were once religious, and feel effective altruism is congruent with their religiously motivated altruism
have received positive feedback from religious folks.
so effective altruism knows better how to reach out to religion.
I am a committed Christian also committed to the principles of effective altruism. I am very frustrated with the level of apathy in the church, given that we are all called to tithe 10% of our income, like the rest of the population Christians have really lost sight of how rich they are now. I am also frustrated by the focus on differences between religions, and between religion and the non religious, when common values of love and concern for our planet giving how utterly amazing it is we are here should prevail. Altruism is at the heart of Christianity and of course it should be effective. I would be happy to work with other EAs in develop an outreach/link strategy into churches.
My wife is head of fundraising for a charity that is like a mini version of Christian aid—donating to poverty alleviating projects in a Christian context. Making this more effective would be a good place to start.
1 billion Christians should be able to make a real dent in the problems of the world if they focussed less on the coffee rota and more on what our faith actually calls us to do.
That’s great, David, and you’re the sort of person I mentioned above. Extending love, compassion, and understanding is a cornerstone of all altruism. I don’t have anything to add now, but I’ll contact you in the future if I broach this topic again.
You might be interested in this chapter on global poverty, utilitarianism, Christian ethics and Peter Singer that I wrote for a Cambridge University Press volume.
http://www.amirrorclear.net/academic/papers/global-poverty.pdf
I would love to see some action in this space. I think there is a natural harmony between what is best in Christianity—especially regarding helping the global poor—and effective altruism.
One person to consider speaking with is Charlie Camosy, who has worked with Peter Singer in the past (see info here). A couple other people to consider talking with would be Catriona Mackay and Alex Foster.
David, which sort of material you think could be persuasive to the higher ecclesiastical orders so that their charity was more focused on Givewell recommended charities and similar sort of evidence based, calculation based giving?
How can we get priests to talk about the child in the pond to the faithful, in a scaleable and tractable manner?
As a result of your faith, are you only interested in working on global poverty, and not x-risk or speciesism?
(It’s great to have you and people like you around; I don’t mean to sound judgemental.)
Religion also often encourages (or is used to defend) speciesism, and it also leads many people to not believe in x-risk. As such, religious EAs are mostly only relevant to 2⁄3 of the major cause areas of EA. Given that I think global poverty is by far the least important of these cause areas, convincing religious people to care about EA doesn’t seem to have very high value to me.
X-risk and animal welfare are still pretty marginalized across the entire population, not just among the religious—and Christians have a very convenient existing infrastructure for collecting money. It might be that there are other reasons not to worry too much about them (e.g. an unmovable hierarchy that controls where the money goes), but their lack of concern for some (or even most) EA target causes doesn’t seem like it should bear much weight.
I think you overlook the strongest argument for spreading religion, namely that by converting people to the One True Faith, we could save them from eternal damnation. As eternity is a long time and damnation is very bad, this would be extremely high QALYs.
Most EAs think all religions are false, so do not subscribe to this argument. However, I do not think religious EAs can avoid this so easily. If you are a Christian EA you should probably try much harder to convert people to Christianity.
My above comment was reasons why effective altruists have found difficulty in reaching out to religion, even though it’s important because much altruism in the world is religiously motivated. However, I understand your point. If someone’s greatest priority is getting others into Heaven by converting them to their own religion, that may be a confounding factor for getting them to do other things.
However, this isn’t the case for all religious people.
How much a religious adherent is supposed to proselytize varies among sects within religions.
From what I know of major world religions, such as Islam, and Christianity, charity is emphasized as an important virtue to act upon independently of, and in addition to, converting others. The moral imperative for charity in religion tends to extend beyond helping only the less fortunate of one’s own religion.
Humans tend to signal their association with an ideology by committing to the goals set out for its adherents. When the goal seems far away, it’s easy for people to promise to achieve it. When the goal is very nearby, its difficulty becomes more apparent, and more people will shirk it. This is called construal-level theory. If you accept that model, I believe it extend to religious conversion. (Some) religious leaders will call upon their followers to convert the unbelieving, yet everyday those same followers fail to confront their neighbors, friends, families, and colleagues from believing differently. As the world becomes more globally interdependent, lots will realize the value in helping and cooperating with groups of outsiders, and their unfortunate.
Religion blends with other cultural forces in people’s lives to cause a diverse array of how they practice, and that still allows effective altruism for millions of religious folks.
Yes, I basically agree. But I think you have slightly misunderstand my argument. Many religions say both
1) You should convert people 2) You should help people
Obviously not all religions say these (for example Judaism is not very evangelical). My argument isn’t that religious people should proletize because of 2). My argument is that, given religious people’s other beliefs about heaven and hell, they should proletize because that is the most effective way of helping people. Even if their religion included no evangelical commandments, they should try to convert people as the most effective way of loving their neighbors. A secular EA charity might try to persuade people in the less economically developed countries to purify their water; a religious EA charity might try to persuade people in the developing world to say their hail marys.