What does it mean to be “pro-science”? In other words, what might a potential welfarist, maximizing, impartial, and non-normative movement that doesn’t meet this criterion look like?
I ask because I don’t have a clear picture of a definition that would be both informative and uncontroversial. For instance, the mainstream scientific community was largely dismissive of SIAI/MIRI for many years; would “proto-EAs” who supported them at that time be considered pro-science? I assume that excluding MIRI does indeed count as controversial, but then I don’t have a clear picture of what activities/causes being “pro-science” would exclude.
As a scientist, I consider science a way of learning about the world, and not what a particular group of people say. I think the article is fairly explicit about taking a similar definition of “science-aligned”:
(i) the use of evidence and careful reasoning to work out...
(...)
Science-aligned. The best means to figuring out how to do the most good is the scientific method, broadly construed to include reliance on careful rigorous argument and theoretical models as well as data.
There is usually a vast body of existing relevant work on a topic across various fields of research. Trying to seriously engage with existing work is part of being scientific; and the opinions or consensus of researchers in the field are a form of data one should not ignore. You can disagree after serious consideration without being unscientific. Simply coming to your own conclusions without engaging with existing work, or acting based on emotion or gut feelings acquired without ever thinking about them critically would be unscientific.
A part of being scientific is also being open to and trying to learn from critiques of your work. It is true that scientists often make bad critiques for bad (unscientific) reasons, and it can take quite a lot of effort to understand the social and historical reasons behind consensus opinions in particular fields on particular issues. I don’t think most EAs would think having a certain degree of support from a particular group of scientists is the relevant criterion.
A possible reason for the downvote is that your initial question ‘What does it mean to be “pro-science”?’ is explicitly answered in the article and it’s not immediately clear that you are acknowledging that and really asking, isn’t everything science-aligned under this definition?
My quick take onto why this was downvoted would be because someone may have glanced at it quickly and assumed you were being negative to MIRI or EA.
I think around being “Science-aligned”, the post means using the principals and learnings of the scientific method and similar tools, rather than agreeing with “the majority of scientists” or similar.
The mainstream scientific community seems also likely to be skeptical of EA, but that doesn’t mean that EA would have to therefore be similarly skeptical of itself.
That said, of course whether one follows the scientific method and similar for some practices, especially in cases where they aren’t backed by many other communities, could be rather up for debate.
What does it mean to be “pro-science”? In other words, what might a potential welfarist, maximizing, impartial, and non-normative movement that doesn’t meet this criterion look like?
I ask because I don’t have a clear picture of a definition that would be both informative and uncontroversial. For instance, the mainstream scientific community was largely dismissive of SIAI/MIRI for many years; would “proto-EAs” who supported them at that time be considered pro-science? I assume that excluding MIRI does indeed count as controversial, but then I don’t have a clear picture of what activities/causes being “pro-science” would exclude.
edit: Why was this downvoted?
As a scientist, I consider science a way of learning about the world, and not what a particular group of people say. I think the article is fairly explicit about taking a similar definition of “science-aligned”:
There is usually a vast body of existing relevant work on a topic across various fields of research. Trying to seriously engage with existing work is part of being scientific; and the opinions or consensus of researchers in the field are a form of data one should not ignore. You can disagree after serious consideration without being unscientific. Simply coming to your own conclusions without engaging with existing work, or acting based on emotion or gut feelings acquired without ever thinking about them critically would be unscientific.
A part of being scientific is also being open to and trying to learn from critiques of your work. It is true that scientists often make bad critiques for bad (unscientific) reasons, and it can take quite a lot of effort to understand the social and historical reasons behind consensus opinions in particular fields on particular issues. I don’t think most EAs would think having a certain degree of support from a particular group of scientists is the relevant criterion.
A possible reason for the downvote is that your initial question ‘What does it mean to be “pro-science”?’ is explicitly answered in the article and it’s not immediately clear that you are acknowledging that and really asking, isn’t everything science-aligned under this definition?
My quick take onto why this was downvoted would be because someone may have glanced at it quickly and assumed you were being negative to MIRI or EA.
I think around being “Science-aligned”, the post means using the principals and learnings of the scientific method and similar tools, rather than agreeing with “the majority of scientists” or similar.
The mainstream scientific community seems also likely to be skeptical of EA, but that doesn’t mean that EA would have to therefore be similarly skeptical of itself.
That said, of course whether one follows the scientific method and similar for some practices, especially in cases where they aren’t backed by many other communities, could be rather up for debate.