It’s really quite something that you wrote almost 2000 words and didn’t include a single primary citation to support any of those claims. Even given that most of them are transparently false to anyone who’s spent 5 minutes reading either LW or the EA Forum, I think I’d be able to dig up something superficially plausible with which to smear them.
And if anyone is curious about why Yarrow might have an axe to grind, they’re welcome to examine this post, along with the associated comment thread.
Edit: changed the link to an archive.org copy, since the post was moved to draft after I posted this.
Edit2: I was incorrect about when it was moved back to a draft, see this comment.
The sources are cited in quite literally the first sentence of the quick take.
To my knowledge, every specific factual claim I made is true and none are false. If you want to challenge one specific factual claim, I would be willing to provide sources for that one claim. But I don’t want to be here all day.
Since I guess you have access to LessWrong’s logs given your bio, are you able to check when and by whom that LessWrong post was moved to drafts, i.e., if it was indeed moved to drafts after your comment and not before, and if it was, whether it was moved to drafts by the user who posted it rather than by a site admin or moderator?
And, indeed, this seems to show your accusation that there was an attempt to hide the post after you brought it up was false. An apology wouldn’t hurt!
The other false accusation was that I didn’t cite any sources, when in fact I did in the very first sentence of my quick take. Apart from that, I also directly linked to an EA Forum post in my quick take. So, however you slice it, that accusation is wrong. Here, too, an apology wouldn’t hurt if you want to signal good faith.
My offer is still open to provide sources for any one factual claim in the quick take if you want to challenge one of them. (But, as I said, I don’t want to be here all day, so please keep it to one.)
Incidentally, in my opinion, that post supports my argument about anti-LGBT attitudes on LessWrong. I don’t think I could have much success persuading LessWrong users of that, however, and that was not the intention of this quick take.
Yes, indeed, there was only an attempt to hide the post three weeks ago. I regret the sloppiness in the details of my accusation.
The other false accusation was that I didn’t cite any sources
I did not say that you did not cite any sources. Perhaps the thing I said was confusingly worded? You did not include any links to any of the incidents that you describe.
Huh? Why not just admit your mistake? Why double down on an error?
By the way, who do you think saved that post in the Wayback Machine on the exact same date it was moved to drafts? A remarkable coincidence, wouldn’t you say?
Your initial comment insinuated that the incidents I described were made up. But the incidents were not made up. They really happened. And I linked both to extensive documentation on Reflective Altruism and directly to a post on the EA Forum so that anyone could verify that the incidents I described occurred.
There was one incident I described that I chose not to include a link to out of consideration for your coworker. I wanted to avoid presenting the quick take as a personal attack on them. (That was not the point of what I wrote.) I still think that is the right call. But I can privately provide the link to anyone who requests it if there is any doubt this incident actually occurred.
But, in any case, I very much doubt we are going to have a constructive conversation at this point. Even though I strongly disagree with your views and I still think you owe me an apology, I sincerely wish you happiness.
It’s really quite something that you wrote almost 2000 words and didn’t include a single primary citation to support any of those claims. Even given that most of them are transparently false to anyone who’s spent 5 minutes reading either LW or the EA Forum, I think I’d be able to dig up something superficially plausible with which to smear them.
And if anyone is curious about why Yarrow might have an axe to grind, they’re welcome to examine this post, along with the associated comment thread.
Edit: changed the link to an archive.org copy,
since the post was moved to draft after I posted this.Edit2: I was incorrect about when it was moved back to a draft, see this comment.
I believe Yarrow is referencing this series of articles from David Thorstadt, which quotes primary sources extensively.
The sources are cited in quite literally the first sentence of the quick take.
To my knowledge, every specific factual claim I made is true and none are false. If you want to challenge one specific factual claim, I would be willing to provide sources for that one claim. But I don’t want to be here all day.
Since I guess you have access to LessWrong’s logs given your bio, are you able to check when and by whom that LessWrong post was moved to drafts, i.e., if it was indeed moved to drafts after your comment and not before, and if it was, whether it was moved to drafts by the user who posted it rather than by a site admin or moderator?
My bad, it was moved back to draft on October 3rd (~3 weeks ago) by you. I copied the link from another post that linked to it.
Hey, so you’re 0 for 2 on your accusations! Want to try again?
And, indeed, this seems to show your accusation that there was an attempt to hide the post after you brought it up was false. An apology wouldn’t hurt!
The other false accusation was that I didn’t cite any sources, when in fact I did in the very first sentence of my quick take. Apart from that, I also directly linked to an EA Forum post in my quick take. So, however you slice it, that accusation is wrong. Here, too, an apology wouldn’t hurt if you want to signal good faith.
My offer is still open to provide sources for any one factual claim in the quick take if you want to challenge one of them. (But, as I said, I don’t want to be here all day, so please keep it to one.)
Incidentally, in my opinion, that post supports my argument about anti-LGBT attitudes on LessWrong. I don’t think I could have much success persuading LessWrong users of that, however, and that was not the intention of this quick take.
Yes, indeed, there was only an attempt to hide the post three weeks ago. I regret the sloppiness in the details of my accusation.
I did not say that you did not cite any sources. Perhaps the thing I said was confusingly worded? You did not include any links to any of the incidents that you describe.
Huh? Why not just admit your mistake? Why double down on an error?
By the way, who do you think saved that post in the Wayback Machine on the exact same date it was moved to drafts? A remarkable coincidence, wouldn’t you say?
Your initial comment insinuated that the incidents I described were made up. But the incidents were not made up. They really happened. And I linked both to extensive documentation on Reflective Altruism and directly to a post on the EA Forum so that anyone could verify that the incidents I described occurred.
There was one incident I described that I chose not to include a link to out of consideration for your coworker. I wanted to avoid presenting the quick take as a personal attack on them. (That was not the point of what I wrote.) I still think that is the right call. But I can privately provide the link to anyone who requests it if there is any doubt this incident actually occurred.
But, in any case, I very much doubt we are going to have a constructive conversation at this point. Even though I strongly disagree with your views and I still think you owe me an apology, I sincerely wish you happiness.