Thank you for taking on this debate, Tobias. Like our target audience in creating not a vegan community, but a vegan world, I share very personal frustration with the guilt and shame approach; not in spite of me wanting the same “total abolition” which the anti-welfarists and anti-incrementalists do, but because I want it. I can see why Bashir is convinced by the anecdotes he’s able to tell, and it reveals to me why science and studies, if done well, is the collection of many helpful anecdotes from a wide and varying population to inform how to work toward everyone’s goal: a world without factory farming that stays without factory farming.
Bruce Friedrich convinced me that vegan activism as it’s been for the past fifty years isn’t working and sent me down the road of meat alternatives as a solution. I’ve been having trouble doing anything to advance it now, so I’ve been looking into dietary incrementalism as another solution to learn about alongside it, which is why I watched the debate. It seems up to each of us to be honest with ourselves about what we’ve tried, how well it’s working, and what other options we have to work toward our goal that hasn’t changed.
On behalf of the voiceless animals, thank you for everything that you do. I’ll remember your book in case I decide to explore reducitarian advocacy further.
thanks for your message. i think that indeed vegan advocacy doesn’t have much to show for after several decades—at least not in terms of the number of vegans. But I do believe in some virtuous cycle between advocacy and alternatives, where the two can reinforce each other (more awareness means higher purchases of PB products means easier awareness...). I hope you can find a role in the movement that fits you and that has impact! :)
Thank you for taking on this debate, Tobias. Like our target audience in creating not a vegan community, but a vegan world, I share very personal frustration with the guilt and shame approach; not in spite of me wanting the same “total abolition” which the anti-welfarists and anti-incrementalists do, but because I want it. I can see why Bashir is convinced by the anecdotes he’s able to tell, and it reveals to me why science and studies, if done well, is the collection of many helpful anecdotes from a wide and varying population to inform how to work toward everyone’s goal: a world without factory farming that stays without factory farming.
Bruce Friedrich convinced me that vegan activism as it’s been for the past fifty years isn’t working and sent me down the road of meat alternatives as a solution. I’ve been having trouble doing anything to advance it now, so I’ve been looking into dietary incrementalism as another solution to learn about alongside it, which is why I watched the debate. It seems up to each of us to be honest with ourselves about what we’ve tried, how well it’s working, and what other options we have to work toward our goal that hasn’t changed.
On behalf of the voiceless animals, thank you for everything that you do. I’ll remember your book in case I decide to explore reducitarian advocacy further.
thanks for your message.
i think that indeed vegan advocacy doesn’t have much to show for after several decades—at least not in terms of the number of vegans. But I do believe in some virtuous cycle between advocacy and alternatives, where the two can reinforce each other (more awareness means higher purchases of PB products means easier awareness...).
I hope you can find a role in the movement that fits you and that has impact! :)