I wanted to downvote this comment. I think discussion on the topic and the dynamics it raises are very much worth discussing without being branded a bigot.
But then I did the exercise of replacing “polyamory” with “gay men” and “monogamous” with “straight” in the comment you responded to and was pretty horrified with the result.
It totally reads like a comment then that would have been socially acceptable not too many years ago, but that we strongly condemn now as homophobia.
I’m kinda just sitting with this info processing it, not entirely sure what conclusion to draw just yet.
I agree with both points—I don’t think it’s productive to call people names, but I do want to draw attention to the parallel you make in this and many of the other comments on this page.
[ETA Maybe bisexuality would be a better metaphor, just for the practical reason that it matches better with the concern people are voicing that ‘this sort of behaviour’ naturally implies a larger number of sexual/romantic dynamics]
I honestly didn’t know how to talk about it either, but wanted to point at general vibes I was getting. While I’m still confused about what‘s the issue exactly, contrary to my initial comment, I don’t really think polyamory within the community is a problem anymore. Not because of Arepo’s comment specifically, but because there are healthy ways to do polyamory just like other forms of relationships. It’s something that I thought was true before writing the comment, but was a bit confused about the whole mixing of career and “free love” with everyone in the community.
Maybe only talking about “free love” mixed with power dynamics and whatever else would have been better. I don’t know really know. Maybe I shouldn’t have said anything as someone confused about all this, but still wanting to help. I felt it was the kind of thing that a lot of people were thinking, but not saying it out loud.
That said, I think Sonia’s video cleared up some things a bit for me. It points to the larger amounts of “hacker houses”, networking, sex, and money in the Bay Area. She also points to polyamory not being the problem. However, she says while those things shape the structure of the problem, it’s power dynamicsthat ends up being the main root issue. It sounds to me like she is pointing to people will sometimes try to become polyamorous with others by abusing power dynamics (even though this is not inherent to most polyamorous relationships at all). Are power dynamics the whole story? I don’t know.
Note that a lot of people seemed to agree with my initial comment. I’m not sure what to make of that.
No judgement from me. You’re talking to someone who used to be quite homophobic and polyphobic and having a caring community where I could be accepted for where I was and work through my thoughts without being labelled an insta-bigot was precisely what I needed.
Note that a lot of people seemed to agree with my initial comment. I’m not sure what to make of that.
A friend of mine recently pointed out that polyamory during the 80′s free love era still only made up like 0.8% of relationships in Canada. Today, even without a mass social movement, in Canada that figure sits around 5% - there has been such an increase that the Canadian government is actually examining the situation to try and figure out if laws should be changed (given the entire system pre-supposes monogamy).
What this suggests to me is that polyamory is orders of magnitude more visible now to EAs that wouldn’t even have known much about it before (other than maybe in the abstract). Novelty of this sort can be uncomfortable (it was for me at first), hence your post getting so many upvotes. Many new to actually seeing polyamory in the real world feel uncomfortable too, even if they cant quite put a reason on why.
I strongly urge anyone reading this sentence to watch Sonia’s video. Given we haven’t heard the same kind of scandals (I don’t think?) outside of the bay (and there are many non-Bay Area poly EAs in the world) and women are reporting it is indeed worse in The Bay, I think looking at the entire situation through the lens of what is different in the Bay Area (i.e. Power Dynamics) is much more fruitful.
It feels like there’s an aspect of “free love” and I am a little concerned about doing cuddle puddles with career colleagues. I feel like all these dynamics lead to weird behaviour people do not want to acknowledge.
nit: a lot of monogamous people engage in cuddle puddles. Problem here is, like you said, the career colleagues part leading to potential abuses of power dynamics.
I wanted to downvote this comment. I think discussion on the topic and the dynamics it raises are very much worth discussing without being branded a bigot.
But then I did the exercise of replacing “polyamory” with “gay men” and “monogamous” with “straight” in the comment you responded to and was pretty horrified with the result.
It totally reads like a comment then that would have been socially acceptable not too many years ago, but that we strongly condemn now as homophobia.
I’m kinda just sitting with this info processing it, not entirely sure what conclusion to draw just yet.
I agree with both points—I don’t think it’s productive to call people names, but I do want to draw attention to the parallel you make in this and many of the other comments on this page.
[ETA Maybe bisexuality would be a better metaphor, just for the practical reason that it matches better with the concern people are voicing that ‘this sort of behaviour’ naturally implies a larger number of sexual/romantic dynamics]
I honestly didn’t know how to talk about it either, but wanted to point at general vibes I was getting. While I’m still confused about what‘s the issue exactly, contrary to my initial comment, I don’t really think polyamory within the community is a problem anymore. Not because of Arepo’s comment specifically, but because there are healthy ways to do polyamory just like other forms of relationships. It’s something that I thought was true before writing the comment, but was a bit confused about the whole mixing of career and “free love” with everyone in the community.
Maybe only talking about “free love” mixed with power dynamics and whatever else would have been better. I don’t know really know. Maybe I shouldn’t have said anything as someone confused about all this, but still wanting to help. I felt it was the kind of thing that a lot of people were thinking, but not saying it out loud.
That said, I think Sonia’s video cleared up some things a bit for me. It points to the larger amounts of “hacker houses”, networking, sex, and money in the Bay Area. She also points to polyamory not being the problem. However, she says while those things shape the structure of the problem, it’s power dynamicsthat ends up being the main root issue. It sounds to me like she is pointing to people will sometimes try to become polyamorous with others by abusing power dynamics (even though this is not inherent to most polyamorous relationships at all). Are power dynamics the whole story? I don’t know.
Note that a lot of people seemed to agree with my initial comment. I’m not sure what to make of that.
No judgement from me. You’re talking to someone who used to be quite homophobic and polyphobic and having a caring community where I could be accepted for where I was and work through my thoughts without being labelled an insta-bigot was precisely what I needed.
A friend of mine recently pointed out that polyamory during the 80′s free love era still only made up like 0.8% of relationships in Canada. Today, even without a mass social movement, in Canada that figure sits around 5% - there has been such an increase that the Canadian government is actually examining the situation to try and figure out if laws should be changed (given the entire system pre-supposes monogamy).
What this suggests to me is that polyamory is orders of magnitude more visible now to EAs that wouldn’t even have known much about it before (other than maybe in the abstract). Novelty of this sort can be uncomfortable (it was for me at first), hence your post getting so many upvotes. Many new to actually seeing polyamory in the real world feel uncomfortable too, even if they cant quite put a reason on why.
I strongly urge anyone reading this sentence to watch Sonia’s video. Given we haven’t heard the same kind of scandals (I don’t think?) outside of the bay (and there are many non-Bay Area poly EAs in the world) and women are reporting it is indeed worse in The Bay, I think looking at the entire situation through the lens of what is different in the Bay Area (i.e. Power Dynamics) is much more fruitful.
nit: a lot of monogamous people engage in cuddle puddles. Problem here is, like you said, the career colleagues part leading to potential abuses of power dynamics.