This isn’t a very direct response to your questions, but is relevant, and is a case for why there might be a risk of factory farming in the long-term future. (This doesn’t address the scenarios from your second question.) [Edit: it does have an attempt at answering your third question at the end.]
--
It may be possible that if plant-based meat substitutes are cheap enough and taste like (smell like, have mouth feel of, etc.) animal-derived meat, then it won’t make economic sense to keep animals for that purpose.
That’s the hopeful take, and I’m guessing maybe a more mainstream take.
If life is always cheaper in the long-run for producing meat substitutes (the best genetic engineering can always produce life that can out-compete the best non-life lab techniques), would it have to be sentient life, or could it be some kind of bacteria or something like that? It doesn’t seem to me that sentience is helpful in making animal protein, and probably just imposes some cost.
(Another hopeful take.)
A less hopeful take: One advantage that life has over non-life, and where sentience might be an advantage, is that it can be let loose in an environment unsupervised and then rounded up for slaughter. So we could imagine “pioneers” on a lifeless planet letting loose some kind of future animal as part of terraforming, then rounding them up and slaughtering them. This is not the same as factory farming, but if the slaughtering process (or rounding-up process) is excessively painful, that is something to be concerned about.
My guess is that one obstacle to humans being kind to animals (or being generous in any other way) has to do with whether they are in “personal survival mode”. Utilitarian altruists might be in a “global survival mode” and care about X-risk. But, when times get hard for people, personally, they tend to become more of “personal survival mode” people. Maybe being a pioneer on a lifeless planet is a hard thing that can go wrong (for the pioneers), and the cultures that are formed by that founding experience will have a hard time being fully generous.
Global survival mode might be compatible with caring about animal welfare. But personal survival mode is probably more effective at solving personal problems than global survival mode (or there is a decent reason to think that it could be), even if global survival mode implies that you should care about your own well-being as part of the whole, because personal survival mode is more desperate and efficient, and so more focused and driven toward the outcome of personal survival. Maybe global survival mode is sufficient for human survival, but it would make sense that personal survival mode could outcompete it and seem attractive when times get hard.
Basically, we can imagine space colonization as a furtherance of our highest levels of civilization, all the colonists selected for their civilized values before being sent out, but maybe each colony would be somewhat fragile and isolated, and could restart at, or devolve to, a lower level of civilization, bringing back to life in it whatever less-civilized values we feel we have grown past. Maybe from that, factory farming could re-emerge.
If we can’t break the speed of light, it seems likely to me that space colonies (at least, if made of humans), will undergo their own cultural evolution and become somewhat estranged from us and each other (because it will be too hard to stay in touch), and that will risk the re-emergence of values we don’t like from human history.
How much of cultural evolution is more or less an automatic response to economic development, and how much is path-dependent? If there is path-dependency, we would want to seed each new space colony with colonists who 1) think globally (or maybe “cosmically” is a better term at this scale), with an expanded moral circle, or more important, a tendency to expand their moral circles; 2) are not intimidated by their own deaths; 3) maybe have other safeguards against personal survival mode; 4) but still are effective enough at surviving. And try to institutionalize those tendencies into an ongoing colonial culture. (So that they can survive, but without going into personal survival mode.) For references for that seeded culture, maybe we would look to past human civilizations which produced people who were more global than they had to be given their economic circumstances, or notably global even in a relatively “disestablished” (chaotic, undeveloped, dysfunctional, insecure) or stressed state or environment.
(That’s a guess at an answer to your third question.)
This isn’t a very direct response to your questions, but is relevant, and is a case for why there might be a risk of factory farming in the long-term future. (This doesn’t address the scenarios from your second question.) [Edit: it does have an attempt at answering your third question at the end.]
--
It may be possible that if plant-based meat substitutes are cheap enough and taste like (smell like, have mouth feel of, etc.) animal-derived meat, then it won’t make economic sense to keep animals for that purpose.
That’s the hopeful take, and I’m guessing maybe a more mainstream take.
If life is always cheaper in the long-run for producing meat substitutes (the best genetic engineering can always produce life that can out-compete the best non-life lab techniques), would it have to be sentient life, or could it be some kind of bacteria or something like that? It doesn’t seem to me that sentience is helpful in making animal protein, and probably just imposes some cost.
(Another hopeful take.)
A less hopeful take: One advantage that life has over non-life, and where sentience might be an advantage, is that it can be let loose in an environment unsupervised and then rounded up for slaughter. So we could imagine “pioneers” on a lifeless planet letting loose some kind of future animal as part of terraforming, then rounding them up and slaughtering them. This is not the same as factory farming, but if the slaughtering process (or rounding-up process) is excessively painful, that is something to be concerned about.
My guess is that one obstacle to humans being kind to animals (or being generous in any other way) has to do with whether they are in “personal survival mode”. Utilitarian altruists might be in a “global survival mode” and care about X-risk. But, when times get hard for people, personally, they tend to become more of “personal survival mode” people. Maybe being a pioneer on a lifeless planet is a hard thing that can go wrong (for the pioneers), and the cultures that are formed by that founding experience will have a hard time being fully generous.
Global survival mode might be compatible with caring about animal welfare. But personal survival mode is probably more effective at solving personal problems than global survival mode (or there is a decent reason to think that it could be), even if global survival mode implies that you should care about your own well-being as part of the whole, because personal survival mode is more desperate and efficient, and so more focused and driven toward the outcome of personal survival. Maybe global survival mode is sufficient for human survival, but it would make sense that personal survival mode could outcompete it and seem attractive when times get hard.
Basically, we can imagine space colonization as a furtherance of our highest levels of civilization, all the colonists selected for their civilized values before being sent out, but maybe each colony would be somewhat fragile and isolated, and could restart at, or devolve to, a lower level of civilization, bringing back to life in it whatever less-civilized values we feel we have grown past. Maybe from that, factory farming could re-emerge.
If we can’t break the speed of light, it seems likely to me that space colonies (at least, if made of humans), will undergo their own cultural evolution and become somewhat estranged from us and each other (because it will be too hard to stay in touch), and that will risk the re-emergence of values we don’t like from human history.
How much of cultural evolution is more or less an automatic response to economic development, and how much is path-dependent? If there is path-dependency, we would want to seed each new space colony with colonists who 1) think globally (or maybe “cosmically” is a better term at this scale), with an expanded moral circle, or more important, a tendency to expand their moral circles; 2) are not intimidated by their own deaths; 3) maybe have other safeguards against personal survival mode; 4) but still are effective enough at surviving. And try to institutionalize those tendencies into an ongoing colonial culture. (So that they can survive, but without going into personal survival mode.) For references for that seeded culture, maybe we would look to past human civilizations which produced people who were more global than they had to be given their economic circumstances, or notably global even in a relatively “disestablished” (chaotic, undeveloped, dysfunctional, insecure) or stressed state or environment.
(That’s a guess at an answer to your third question.)
This is SUPER interesting. And it’s amazing that you have put so much thought into this exact issue!
Also, I love that everybody who responded is named James! :-)
Hi James (Banks), I wrote a post on why PB/CM might not eliminate factory farming. Would be great if you can give me some feedback there.