I also thought along similar lines, although (lacking subtlety) I thought you could shove in a light cone from the dot, which can serve double duty as the expanding future. Another thing you could do is play with a gradient so this curve/​the future gets brighter as well as bigger, but perhaps someone who can at least successfully colour in have a comparative advantage here.
I agree with others that this concept is great, but that the gradient probably isn’t a great idea.
Here’s a very quick inkscape version without the dot. (Any final version would want a smoother curve but I wanted to get this done quickly)
While I personally like monochrome a lot (the Cornish flag is one of my favourites), I worry that it will be a bit too stark for most people. Changing the colour could also help reduce the association with space a bit. Here’s a couple of quick versions using Cullen’s colour scheme from the hourglass concept below.
I’m not sure whether I prefer these or the hourglass concept.
I really like the aesthetics of these, though I’m not sure if that’s because they resemble nautical flags, which for me trigger positive associations with sailing during my childhood.
In general, I would say the immediate appeal of the flag on a System-1 level is much more important that the story behind it, which a minuscule fraction of those exposed to it will ever learn. Moreover, it’s easier to construct an adequate story for a relatively simple flag design, and such designs are also more apt to be aesthetically appealing.
In general, I would say the immediate appeal of the flag on a System-1 level is much more important that the story behind it, which a minuscule fraction of those exposed to it will ever learn. Moreover, it’s easier to construct an adequate story for a relatively simple flag design, and such designs are also more apt to be aesthetically appealing.
I really like the aesthetics of these, though I’m not sure if that’s because they resemble nautical flags, which for me trigger positive associations with sailing during childhood.
As an example, I in no way intended these to resemble nautical flags, but I think we can totally work that into our longtermist symbolism post-hoc. :-P
(Though I’d also probably be happy with other colour schemes)
Yeah, this is cool! Although maybe too expansionist—it suggests that we plan to conquer our light cone, which might mean defending it against non-Earth-originating life. Separately, I guess adding a colour gradient is bad, since that’s harder to draw, and flags usually don’t have them.
I like this. Ryan’s original example, whilst a pretty good suggestion overall, gives the impression of insignificance, whereas this one gives the impression of insignificance mixed with vast potential and hope for something more.
The only reservation I have is that this flag might imply that longtermism is only valid if we can spread to the stars. I think the jury is still out on whether or not this is actually the case? It has been suggested that existential security may only be possible if we spread out in the universe, but I’m not sure if this is generally accepted?
Another consideration is that one may want the flag or symbol to have relatively direct temporal associations (one way or the other), since longtermism concerns time. It seems to me that Ryan’s suggestion doesn’t have that; at least not very directly—it’s more about us being small relative to the vastness of the universe, which is something spatial rather than temporal.
Greg’s suggestion has stronger and more direct temporal associations, I’d say.
Generally, it’s of course not very straightforward to represent something temporal visually.
I also thought along similar lines, although (lacking subtlety) I thought you could shove in a light cone from the dot, which can serve double duty as the expanding future. Another thing you could do is play with a gradient so this curve/​the future gets brighter as well as bigger, but perhaps someone who can at least successfully colour in have a comparative advantage here.
I agree with others that this concept is great, but that the gradient probably isn’t a great idea.
Here’s a very quick inkscape version without the dot. (Any final version would want a smoother curve but I wanted to get this done quickly)
While I personally like monochrome a lot (the Cornish flag is one of my favourites), I worry that it will be a bit too stark for most people. Changing the colour could also help reduce the association with space a bit. Here’s a couple of quick versions using Cullen’s colour scheme from the hourglass concept below.
I’m not sure whether I prefer these or the hourglass concept.
I really like the aesthetics of these, though I’m not sure if that’s because they resemble nautical flags, which for me trigger positive associations with sailing during my childhood.
In general, I would say the immediate appeal of the flag on a System-1 level is much more important that the story behind it, which a minuscule fraction of those exposed to it will ever learn. Moreover, it’s easier to construct an adequate story for a relatively simple flag design, and such designs are also more apt to be aesthetically appealing.
Strongly agree with this.
As an example, I in no way intended these to resemble nautical flags, but I think we can totally work that into our longtermist symbolism post-hoc. :-P
(Though I’d also probably be happy with other colour schemes)
Yeah, this is cool! Although maybe too expansionist—it suggests that we plan to conquer our light cone, which might mean defending it against non-Earth-originating life. Separately, I guess adding a colour gradient is bad, since that’s harder to draw, and flags usually don’t have them.
Also like this concept a lot
I like this. Ryan’s original example, whilst a pretty good suggestion overall, gives the impression of insignificance, whereas this one gives the impression of insignificance mixed with vast potential and hope for something more.
The only reservation I have is that this flag might imply that longtermism is only valid if we can spread to the stars. I think the jury is still out on whether or not this is actually the case? It has been suggested that existential security may only be possible if we spread out in the universe, but I’m not sure if this is generally accepted?
Perhaps I’m being overly nitpicky though.
Another consideration is that one may want the flag or symbol to have relatively direct temporal associations (one way or the other), since longtermism concerns time. It seems to me that Ryan’s suggestion doesn’t have that; at least not very directly—it’s more about us being small relative to the vastness of the universe, which is something spatial rather than temporal.
Greg’s suggestion has stronger and more direct temporal associations, I’d say.
Generally, it’s of course not very straightforward to represent something temporal visually.
Oh man, this is pretty cool. I actually like the fact that it’s sort of jagged and crazy.
Appreciate you drawing this, I like the idea.