That flag is cool, but here’s an alternative that uses some of the same ideas.
The black background represents the vastness of space, and its current emptiness. The blue dot represents our fragile home. The ratio of their sizes represents the importance of our cosmic potential (larger version here).
A “Pale Blue Dot” flag for longtermism
It’s also a reference to Carl Sagan’s Pale Blue Dot—a photo taken of Earth, from a spacecraft that is now further from Earth than any other human-made object, and that was the first to leave our solar system.
Carl Sagan’s Pale Blue Dot
Sagan wrote this famous passage about the image:
Look again at that dot. That’s here. That’s home. That’s us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every “superstar,” every “supreme leader,” every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there-on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
The Earth is a very small stage in a vast cosmic arena. Think of the endless cruelties visited by the inhabitants of one corner of this pixel on the scarcely distinguishable inhabitants of some other corner, how frequent their misunderstandings, how eager they are to kill one another, how fervent their hatreds. Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that, in glory and triumph, they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot.
Our posturings, our imagined self-importance, the delusion that we have some privileged position in the Universe, are challenged by this point of pale light. Our planet is a lonely speck in the great enveloping cosmic dark. In our obscurity, in all this vastness, there is no hint that help will come from elsewhere to save us from ourselves.
The Earth is the only world known so far to harbor life. There is nowhere else, at least in the near future, to which our species could migrate. Visit, yes. Settle, not yet. Like it or not, for the moment the Earth is where we make our stand.
It has been said that astronomy is a humbling and character-building experience. There is perhaps no better demonstration of the folly of human conceits than this distant image of our tiny world. To me, it underscores our responsibility to deal more kindly with one another, and to preserve and cherish the pale blue dot, the only home we’ve ever known.
I also thought along similar lines, although (lacking subtlety) I thought you could shove in a light cone from the dot, which can serve double duty as the expanding future. Another thing you could do is play with a gradient so this curve/the future gets brighter as well as bigger, but perhaps someone who can at least successfully colour in have a comparative advantage here.
I agree with others that this concept is great, but that the gradient probably isn’t a great idea.
Here’s a very quick inkscape version without the dot. (Any final version would want a smoother curve but I wanted to get this done quickly)
While I personally like monochrome a lot (the Cornish flag is one of my favourites), I worry that it will be a bit too stark for most people. Changing the colour could also help reduce the association with space a bit. Here’s a couple of quick versions using Cullen’s colour scheme from the hourglass concept below.
I’m not sure whether I prefer these or the hourglass concept.
I really like the aesthetics of these, though I’m not sure if that’s because they resemble nautical flags, which for me trigger positive associations with sailing during my childhood.
In general, I would say the immediate appeal of the flag on a System-1 level is much more important that the story behind it, which a minuscule fraction of those exposed to it will ever learn. Moreover, it’s easier to construct an adequate story for a relatively simple flag design, and such designs are also more apt to be aesthetically appealing.
In general, I would say the immediate appeal of the flag on a System-1 level is much more important that the story behind it, which a minuscule fraction of those exposed to it will ever learn. Moreover, it’s easier to construct an adequate story for a relatively simple flag design, and such designs are also more apt to be aesthetically appealing.
I really like the aesthetics of these, though I’m not sure if that’s because they resemble nautical flags, which for me trigger positive associations with sailing during childhood.
As an example, I in no way intended these to resemble nautical flags, but I think we can totally work that into our longtermist symbolism post-hoc. :-P
(Though I’d also probably be happy with other colour schemes)
Yeah, this is cool! Although maybe too expansionist—it suggests that we plan to conquer our light cone, which might mean defending it against non-Earth-originating life. Separately, I guess adding a colour gradient is bad, since that’s harder to draw, and flags usually don’t have them.
I like this. Ryan’s original example, whilst a pretty good suggestion overall, gives the impression of insignificance, whereas this one gives the impression of insignificance mixed with vast potential and hope for something more.
The only reservation I have is that this flag might imply that longtermism is only valid if we can spread to the stars. I think the jury is still out on whether or not this is actually the case? It has been suggested that existential security may only be possible if we spread out in the universe, but I’m not sure if this is generally accepted?
Another consideration is that one may want the flag or symbol to have relatively direct temporal associations (one way or the other), since longtermism concerns time. It seems to me that Ryan’s suggestion doesn’t have that; at least not very directly—it’s more about us being small relative to the vastness of the universe, which is something spatial rather than temporal.
Greg’s suggestion has stronger and more direct temporal associations, I’d say.
Generally, it’s of course not very straightforward to represent something temporal visually.
Well we are working on making the dot bigger but that takes time; realistically we want to have a flag design before the generation ships reach their destinations.
That flag is cool, but here’s an alternative that uses some of the same ideas.
The black background represents the vastness of space, and its current emptiness. The blue dot represents our fragile home. The ratio of their sizes represents the importance of our cosmic potential (larger version here).
It’s also a reference to Carl Sagan’s Pale Blue Dot—a photo taken of Earth, from a spacecraft that is now further from Earth than any other human-made object, and that was the first to leave our solar system.
Sagan wrote this famous passage about the image:
I also thought along similar lines, although (lacking subtlety) I thought you could shove in a light cone from the dot, which can serve double duty as the expanding future. Another thing you could do is play with a gradient so this curve/the future gets brighter as well as bigger, but perhaps someone who can at least successfully colour in have a comparative advantage here.
I agree with others that this concept is great, but that the gradient probably isn’t a great idea.
Here’s a very quick inkscape version without the dot. (Any final version would want a smoother curve but I wanted to get this done quickly)
While I personally like monochrome a lot (the Cornish flag is one of my favourites), I worry that it will be a bit too stark for most people. Changing the colour could also help reduce the association with space a bit. Here’s a couple of quick versions using Cullen’s colour scheme from the hourglass concept below.
I’m not sure whether I prefer these or the hourglass concept.
I really like the aesthetics of these, though I’m not sure if that’s because they resemble nautical flags, which for me trigger positive associations with sailing during my childhood.
In general, I would say the immediate appeal of the flag on a System-1 level is much more important that the story behind it, which a minuscule fraction of those exposed to it will ever learn. Moreover, it’s easier to construct an adequate story for a relatively simple flag design, and such designs are also more apt to be aesthetically appealing.
Strongly agree with this.
As an example, I in no way intended these to resemble nautical flags, but I think we can totally work that into our longtermist symbolism post-hoc. :-P
(Though I’d also probably be happy with other colour schemes)
Yeah, this is cool! Although maybe too expansionist—it suggests that we plan to conquer our light cone, which might mean defending it against non-Earth-originating life. Separately, I guess adding a colour gradient is bad, since that’s harder to draw, and flags usually don’t have them.
Also like this concept a lot
I like this. Ryan’s original example, whilst a pretty good suggestion overall, gives the impression of insignificance, whereas this one gives the impression of insignificance mixed with vast potential and hope for something more.
The only reservation I have is that this flag might imply that longtermism is only valid if we can spread to the stars. I think the jury is still out on whether or not this is actually the case? It has been suggested that existential security may only be possible if we spread out in the universe, but I’m not sure if this is generally accepted?
Perhaps I’m being overly nitpicky though.
Another consideration is that one may want the flag or symbol to have relatively direct temporal associations (one way or the other), since longtermism concerns time. It seems to me that Ryan’s suggestion doesn’t have that; at least not very directly—it’s more about us being small relative to the vastness of the universe, which is something spatial rather than temporal.
Greg’s suggestion has stronger and more direct temporal associations, I’d say.
Generally, it’s of course not very straightforward to represent something temporal visually.
Oh man, this is pretty cool. I actually like the fact that it’s sort of jagged and crazy.
Appreciate you drawing this, I like the idea.
I like the concept a ton, but think the dot is a bit too small, aesthetically and functionally.
Well we are working on making the dot bigger but that takes time; realistically we want to have a flag design before the generation ships reach their destinations.