Standard debate rules suck. They are about winning, not finding truth.
I really don’t like the way people use this meme, even if I agree with some of the sentiment.
Rules vs. culture: I think a lot of people base this on observing the really terrible practices[1] that have formed in some public school debate leagues (or the generally bad debates on IQ2/IQ2US[2]) and then they assume that the rules are to blame. The reality is that culture matters a lot: policy debate in homeschool leagues (where I debated in high school) is radically different from that in public schools (e.g., it’s mostly sane), and the rules aren’t significantly different. It’s largely due to factors such as coaches telling people not to make dumb arguments, the judging pool drawing more from community (inexperienced) judges, having an example of what not to become, etc. Although I certainly support modifying the rules, I feel fairly confident that the exact same rules used in public school policy debate could produce good debates when used by people in/around EA (or at the very least, they would not produce the same problems of nonsense arguments, speed & spread, and other gamification).
Back and forth is important: I wasn’t particularly fond of the debate format you described, although I’m not sure I fully understood it, and I certainly think that it could still produce a good debate even if the rules are not ideal. I think that one of the most important/beneficial characteristics of debate rounds is that they should incentivize people to go beyond surface-level responses and actually dig deep into evidence and reasoning. Although it might seem like having 40 minutes of (loose) cross-examination is helpful for achieving this goal, I think this is far from optimal: people should have more than 3 minutes to present their arguments; how is the interviewee supposed to present the most compelling arguments for their side if the other side just chooses not to ask “what are the most compelling arguments for your side?” And the interruption aspect is also potentially quite problematic: when does the interviewer decide to cut the interviewee off and move on? Ultimately, I would recommend given both sides far more than 3 minutes for opening arguments, perhaps like ~8 minutes for a constructive speech and perhaps with the option to accept points of information from the opposing speaker, as in American and British parliamentary.
Define the debate well: A major failure mode of debate rounds (both among experienced and inexperienced participants) is that the two sides end up disagreeing about how to even interpret the resolution. This is more reason for giving debaters more than 3 minutes for opening arguments—or perhaps this might be the most valuable way to use the “interview” time: have the debaters figure out what a fair interpretation of the resolution looks like and set up some initial (perhaps fuzzy) criteria for what upholding/rejecting the resolution looks like. (Then I would recommend they each be given ~8 minutes for a constructive speech.)
Signpost and Delineate: A major failure mode of debate among non-debater participants is that they just treat the topic like a college lecture or speech, weaving together ideas without clear delineation and explicit relationships between points. Please ensure the debaters understand what it means to give taglines/signposts for arguments (as I have done for the points in this comment), and strongly suggest they try not to go back and forth between different arguments (at least, not without clear signposting).
Note-taking is crucial: Regardless of whether you change any of the rules/format, I would strongly encourage you to have someone who is familiar with taking notes (“flowing”) in a debate do so for the audience. As most debaters in my former league would probably tell you, flowing is absolutely crucial, especially for those who are trying to judge what’s been said. Unfortunately, too often people think they can just judge based on memory and vibes (and/or they realize traditional note-taking is usually ineffective and don’t realize there’s an alternative), but this is very unreliable.
I think one of the major reasons for these debates being bad is that they just choose resolutions that are written for buzz/appeal rather than for setting up a good, clear debate—and then the debaters themselves are often not actually experienced debaters and they do not adequately define terms or interpret the resolution fairly.
I really don’t like the way people use this meme, even if I agree with some of the sentiment.
Rules vs. culture: I think a lot of people base this on observing the really terrible practices[1] that have formed in some public school debate leagues (or the generally bad debates on IQ2/IQ2US[2]) and then they assume that the rules are to blame. The reality is that culture matters a lot: policy debate in homeschool leagues (where I debated in high school) is radically different from that in public schools (e.g., it’s mostly sane), and the rules aren’t significantly different. It’s largely due to factors such as coaches telling people not to make dumb arguments, the judging pool drawing more from community (inexperienced) judges, having an example of what not to become, etc. Although I certainly support modifying the rules, I feel fairly confident that the exact same rules used in public school policy debate could produce good debates when used by people in/around EA (or at the very least, they would not produce the same problems of nonsense arguments, speed & spread, and other gamification).
Back and forth is important: I wasn’t particularly fond of the debate format you described, although I’m not sure I fully understood it, and I certainly think that it could still produce a good debate even if the rules are not ideal. I think that one of the most important/beneficial characteristics of debate rounds is that they should incentivize people to go beyond surface-level responses and actually dig deep into evidence and reasoning. Although it might seem like having 40 minutes of (loose) cross-examination is helpful for achieving this goal, I think this is far from optimal: people should have more than 3 minutes to present their arguments; how is the interviewee supposed to present the most compelling arguments for their side if the other side just chooses not to ask “what are the most compelling arguments for your side?” And the interruption aspect is also potentially quite problematic: when does the interviewer decide to cut the interviewee off and move on? Ultimately, I would recommend given both sides far more than 3 minutes for opening arguments, perhaps like ~8 minutes for a constructive speech and perhaps with the option to accept points of information from the opposing speaker, as in American and British parliamentary.
Define the debate well: A major failure mode of debate rounds (both among experienced and inexperienced participants) is that the two sides end up disagreeing about how to even interpret the resolution. This is more reason for giving debaters more than 3 minutes for opening arguments—or perhaps this might be the most valuable way to use the “interview” time: have the debaters figure out what a fair interpretation of the resolution looks like and set up some initial (perhaps fuzzy) criteria for what upholding/rejecting the resolution looks like. (Then I would recommend they each be given ~8 minutes for a constructive speech.)
Signpost and Delineate: A major failure mode of debate among non-debater participants is that they just treat the topic like a college lecture or speech, weaving together ideas without clear delineation and explicit relationships between points. Please ensure the debaters understand what it means to give taglines/signposts for arguments (as I have done for the points in this comment), and strongly suggest they try not to go back and forth between different arguments (at least, not without clear signposting).
Note-taking is crucial: Regardless of whether you change any of the rules/format, I would strongly encourage you to have someone who is familiar with taking notes (“flowing”) in a debate do so for the audience. As most debaters in my former league would probably tell you, flowing is absolutely crucial, especially for those who are trying to judge what’s been said. Unfortunately, too often people think they can just judge based on memory and vibes (and/or they realize traditional note-taking is usually ineffective and don’t realize there’s an alternative), but this is very unreliable.
e.g., speed & spread, kritiks, performative cases, excessive/nonsensical nuclear war disadvantages.
I think one of the major reasons for these debates being bad is that they just choose resolutions that are written for buzz/appeal rather than for setting up a good, clear debate—and then the debaters themselves are often not actually experienced debaters and they do not adequately define terms or interpret the resolution fairly.