I think the point is that some previously highly engaged EAs may have become less engaged (so dropped out of the 1000 people), or some would-be-engaged people didn’t become engaged, due to the community’s strong emphasis of longtermism. So I think it’s all the same point, not two separate points.
I think I personally know a lot more EAs who have changed their views to longtermism than EAs who have dropped out of EA due to its longtermist focus. If that’s true of the community as a whole (which I’m not sure about), the main point stands.
This is very much an aside, but I would be really curious how many people you perceive as having changed their views to longtermism would actually agree with this. (According to David’s analysis, it is probably a decent amount.)
E.g. I’m wondering whether I would count in this category. From the outside I might have looked like I changed my views towards longtermism, while from the inside I would describe my views as pretty agnostic, but I prioritised community preferences over my own. There might also be some people who felt like they had to appear to have or act on longtermist views to not lose access to the community.
Some may also have started off longtermist without that being obvious—I knew I was a total utilitarian and cared about the long run future from ~2009, but didn’t feel like I knew how to act on that until much later. So I guess from the outside my views may look like they changed over the last couple of years in a way they didn’t.
I think the point is that some previously highly engaged EAs may have become less engaged (so dropped out of the 1000 people), or some would-be-engaged people didn’t become engaged, due to the community’s strong emphasis of longtermism. So I think it’s all the same point, not two separate points.
I think I personally know a lot more EAs who have changed their views to longtermism than EAs who have dropped out of EA due to its longtermist focus. If that’s true of the community as a whole (which I’m not sure about), the main point stands.
This is very much an aside, but I would be really curious how many people you perceive as having changed their views to longtermism would actually agree with this. (According to David’s analysis, it is probably a decent amount.)
E.g. I’m wondering whether I would count in this category. From the outside I might have looked like I changed my views towards longtermism, while from the inside I would describe my views as pretty agnostic, but I prioritised community preferences over my own. There might also be some people who felt like they had to appear to have or act on longtermist views to not lose access to the community.
Some may also have started off longtermist without that being obvious—I knew I was a total utilitarian and cared about the long run future from ~2009, but didn’t feel like I knew how to act on that until much later. So I guess from the outside my views may look like they changed over the last couple of years in a way they didn’t.
Yeah, I think this is worth taking seriously. (FWIW, I think I had been mostly (though perhaps not completely) aware that you are agnostic.)