Completely agree with Jason. I don’t think those two discussions you are mentioning Nathan actually carry much risk of influence loss, and with AI maybe there has Even been meet influence gain. Things like that that 95 percent of people consider “weird, pointless and stupid” don’t actually have a serious risk of reputational loss. I think looking at most past wins and saying “oh we might not have talked about that is we had been worried about influence” can be a bit of a strawman
It can’t be a strawman if I am arguing it. I am the man.
We can disagree, but I think a move from truthseeking in the past would probably have led to a less-endorsed present (unless it turned off SBF somehow).
I might just not understand the strawman concept properly then, I thought someone could hold a position which was a “strawman” while they were arguing it but uncertain...
Anyway regardless my point is I don’t think we have an example of truth seeking which led a serious cause area which then turned out to cause major influence loss for the community.
I think it’s just really hard to say “don’t discuss that” without nixing a lot of other useful discussion too. I wish there were a way to stop just racism, but already it’s been implied that guests associated with genetics (Steve Hsu, the Collinses, etc) are also trafficking in unacceptable ideas. Should that be banned as well?
And if we’d taken this view 20 years ago we could be in a different place today. Singer advocates for disabled children to be killed, Bostrom partly advocates for a global police state, Yudkowsky doesn’t think that babies are conscious. If we ignored all ideas that came from or near people with awful ideas, we would have lost a lot of ideas we now value.
If you want me to say “I don’t like Hanania” I will say it. But if you want me to say “Manifest is bad because they invited 40 people who could conceivably be racist” then no, I don’t endorse that.
Well had the consensus around WAW and AI taken longer to appear we might endorse the situation we are in less than we currently do.
Completely agree with Jason. I don’t think those two discussions you are mentioning Nathan actually carry much risk of influence loss, and with AI maybe there has Even been meet influence gain. Things like that that 95 percent of people consider “weird, pointless and stupid” don’t actually have a serious risk of reputational loss. I think looking at most past wins and saying “oh we might not have talked about that is we had been worried about influence” can be a bit of a strawman
It can’t be a strawman if I am arguing it. I am the man.
We can disagree, but I think a move from truthseeking in the past would probably have led to a less-endorsed present (unless it turned off SBF somehow).
You’re the man Nathan :D love it!
I might just not understand the strawman concept properly then, I thought someone could hold a position which was a “strawman” while they were arguing it but uncertain...
Anyway regardless my point is I don’t think we have an example of truth seeking which led a serious cause area which then turned out to cause major influence loss for the community.
I think it’s just really hard to say “don’t discuss that” without nixing a lot of other useful discussion too. I wish there were a way to stop just racism, but already it’s been implied that guests associated with genetics (Steve Hsu, the Collinses, etc) are also trafficking in unacceptable ideas. Should that be banned as well?
And if we’d taken this view 20 years ago we could be in a different place today. Singer advocates for disabled children to be killed, Bostrom partly advocates for a global police state, Yudkowsky doesn’t think that babies are conscious. If we ignored all ideas that came from or near people with awful ideas, we would have lost a lot of ideas we now value.
If you want me to say “I don’t like Hanania” I will say it. But if you want me to say “Manifest is bad because they invited 40 people who could conceivably be racist” then no, I don’t endorse that.