Thank you so much for posting this! I had a similar experience with my daughter last night. Stalling bedtime, I was getting frustrated, she was constantly asking to go to the toilet, which I eventually decided was just a tactic (because nothing was happening when she went). Turns out she did have a poorly tummy during the night...and I felt a little shameful. As my frustration built up, I lost sight of what else could be going on (she had her flu vaccine a couple of days ago). Fast forward to this morning where I apologised and smothered her in cuddles. Sometimes we need to breathe, resolve to go with the flow, and see the bigger picture.
Aw, so relatable! Thanks for sharing. And I love how you’re modeling how parents apologize to kids when we get it wrong, that is really important to me with my kids.
As someone without kids, I’m a bit confused by this—why would it not be the default to e.g. ask her why she needs to go again from the second time onwards?
Kids can’t always easily explain what’s going on. Even adults would have a tough time answering that question I think! Most would probably just say ”… because I need to use the bathroom??”
I’m not sure if this is helpful, but the other night, my 3-year-old son Teddy decided to start screaming for milk after we were in bed. He already had two cups of milk when we were downstairs, and there was no more milk. I explained and asked if he was thirsty. He said he was. I gave him a bottle of water. He screamed, “I want miiiiiilk” over and over and rejected the water. Eventually, I just cuddled him in bed. He cried for about a minute once I cuddled him up, and he passed out. It seems like he was overtired but also wanted to go downstairs and delay sleep for some reason? Or maybe he was just desperate for milk for some reason, even though he had a bunch. I’m not totally sure what was going on.
We now have a deal that I will ask him about milk right before bed, but once we are upstairs with teeth brushed, I won’t be going down for milk. Wish me luck!
I think there is a lot going on. For one, kids are equipped to deceive but are not equipped to learn when to deceive. So to learn how deceit/trust works in social settings they have to experiment on their parents—you often catch your kids silently raiding the candy cupboard in the kitchen. So that kind of makes you skeptical of them. Then I think there is a cultural thing where it is ok not to trust your kids that much. This I feel less sure about the validity of, but I think it is a thing. If your boss would have as little trust in you as the average parent has in their child, I think it would feel terrible (I am not insinuating anything about the author here, this is just general observations of young families). I think there is more to it too (including language as Kirsten pointed out) and kids seem to cope well even though they often do not get much trust—maybe kids are emotionally equipped to deal with not being trusted that much—they are pretty happy go lucky. And I am sure there are many more aspects I am missing, like the parents being exhausted, etc.
My five-year-old Earnie generally doesn’t lie. For example, if I ask, “Why is Teddy crying?” he will say, “I took the bike from him”. He sometimes does “tricking,” but usually that’s something very silly and obvious. (Note: I can imagine looking back at this in a few months and being surprised. Things often go in phases with kids.)
I think he learned about deceit and trust, at least in part because I make a point of not lying to my kids. When they are skeptical of something I’ve said, I’ll ask them, “Do I lie?” and they will reflect and say, “Mommy doesn’t lie.”
Our 3-year-old seems not quite on the no-lying page yet (he seems to enjoy it and giggles about it sometimes). Recently, he has seemed to treat pinky promises with more reverence, but we’ll see.
I’m curious if you remember how you felt about these things as a child, or where you get this model of kids’ psychology from? as this was basically the opposite of my experience as a kid.
I should maybe have made it clearer that I am speaking to a large part from my own experience. That said I have done lay reading of psychology and combined with quite consistent observations of multiple kids I feel quite sure about some claims (like the need to develop skill in when to deceit/how to build trust). Other claims I feel less certain about, like that they are more equipped than adults to not be trusted. I should probably have made it clearer how certain I was about each of the claims and what, if any, research or observations underpinned each of my claims. Thanks for holding me accountable on my epistemics! I also recognize after reading your comment that there is a lot of diversity in kids and perhaps there are kids that suffer a great deal from not being trusted, and kids that might not actually choose to engage much in deceitful behavior. And perhaps it reflects on my own failing as a parent haha!
Yeah the point about needing to learn the relevant skills/norms makes sense to me. I just feel nervous about assuming that because a kid doesn’t seem to be negatively affected by their parents being suspicious of them, that they aren’t—knowing how much of a negative effect from another person on your wellbeing and sense of self you ought to tolerate is also a thing to be learned.
If your boss would have as little trust in you as the average parent has in their child, I think it would feel terrible
On the other hand, if you lied to your boss as frequently and blatantly as most kids lie to their parents, you should expect not to keep your job for long. In other words, the trust may be lower, but the consequences/expectations are also lower.
Thank you so much for posting this! I had a similar experience with my daughter last night. Stalling bedtime, I was getting frustrated, she was constantly asking to go to the toilet, which I eventually decided was just a tactic (because nothing was happening when she went). Turns out she did have a poorly tummy during the night...and I felt a little shameful. As my frustration built up, I lost sight of what else could be going on (she had her flu vaccine a couple of days ago). Fast forward to this morning where I apologised and smothered her in cuddles. Sometimes we need to breathe, resolve to go with the flow, and see the bigger picture.
Aw, so relatable! Thanks for sharing. And I love how you’re modeling how parents apologize to kids when we get it wrong, that is really important to me with my kids.
I hope she is feeling better!
As someone without kids, I’m a bit confused by this—why would it not be the default to e.g. ask her why she needs to go again from the second time onwards?
Kids can’t always easily explain what’s going on. Even adults would have a tough time answering that question I think! Most would probably just say ”… because I need to use the bathroom??”
I would have thought ‘my tummy hurts’ would be fairly easy to articulate, but possibly I’m overrating the relevant abilities
I’m not sure if this is helpful, but the other night, my 3-year-old son Teddy decided to start screaming for milk after we were in bed. He already had two cups of milk when we were downstairs, and there was no more milk. I explained and asked if he was thirsty. He said he was. I gave him a bottle of water. He screamed, “I want miiiiiilk” over and over and rejected the water. Eventually, I just cuddled him in bed. He cried for about a minute once I cuddled him up, and he passed out. It seems like he was overtired but also wanted to go downstairs and delay sleep for some reason? Or maybe he was just desperate for milk for some reason, even though he had a bunch. I’m not totally sure what was going on.
We now have a deal that I will ask him about milk right before bed, but once we are upstairs with teeth brushed, I won’t be going down for milk. Wish me luck!
I think there is a lot going on. For one, kids are equipped to deceive but are not equipped to learn when to deceive. So to learn how deceit/trust works in social settings they have to experiment on their parents—you often catch your kids silently raiding the candy cupboard in the kitchen. So that kind of makes you skeptical of them. Then I think there is a cultural thing where it is ok not to trust your kids that much. This I feel less sure about the validity of, but I think it is a thing. If your boss would have as little trust in you as the average parent has in their child, I think it would feel terrible (I am not insinuating anything about the author here, this is just general observations of young families). I think there is more to it too (including language as Kirsten pointed out) and kids seem to cope well even though they often do not get much trust—maybe kids are emotionally equipped to deal with not being trusted that much—they are pretty happy go lucky. And I am sure there are many more aspects I am missing, like the parents being exhausted, etc.
My five-year-old Earnie generally doesn’t lie. For example, if I ask, “Why is Teddy crying?” he will say, “I took the bike from him”. He sometimes does “tricking,” but usually that’s something very silly and obvious. (Note: I can imagine looking back at this in a few months and being surprised. Things often go in phases with kids.)
I think he learned about deceit and trust, at least in part because I make a point of not lying to my kids. When they are skeptical of something I’ve said, I’ll ask them, “Do I lie?” and they will reflect and say, “Mommy doesn’t lie.”
Our 3-year-old seems not quite on the no-lying page yet (he seems to enjoy it and giggles about it sometimes). Recently, he has seemed to treat pinky promises with more reverence, but we’ll see.
I’m curious if you remember how you felt about these things as a child, or where you get this model of kids’ psychology from? as this was basically the opposite of my experience as a kid.
I should maybe have made it clearer that I am speaking to a large part from my own experience. That said I have done lay reading of psychology and combined with quite consistent observations of multiple kids I feel quite sure about some claims (like the need to develop skill in when to deceit/how to build trust). Other claims I feel less certain about, like that they are more equipped than adults to not be trusted. I should probably have made it clearer how certain I was about each of the claims and what, if any, research or observations underpinned each of my claims. Thanks for holding me accountable on my epistemics! I also recognize after reading your comment that there is a lot of diversity in kids and perhaps there are kids that suffer a great deal from not being trusted, and kids that might not actually choose to engage much in deceitful behavior. And perhaps it reflects on my own failing as a parent haha!
Yeah the point about needing to learn the relevant skills/norms makes sense to me. I just feel nervous about assuming that because a kid doesn’t seem to be negatively affected by their parents being suspicious of them, that they aren’t—knowing how much of a negative effect from another person on your wellbeing and sense of self you ought to tolerate is also a thing to be learned.
Good points!
On the other hand, if you lied to your boss as frequently and blatantly as most kids lie to their parents, you should expect not to keep your job for long. In other words, the trust may be lower, but the consequences/expectations are also lower.