Assume by default that if something is missing in EA, nobody else is going to step up.
It was a difficult job, he thought to himself, but somebody had to do it.
As he walked away, he wondered who that somebody will be.
The best way to get “EAs” to do something is by doing it yourself.
The second best way is to pitch a specific person to do it, with a specific, targeted ask, a quick explanation for why your proposed activity is better than that person’s nearest counterfactuals, get enthusiastic, direct affirmation that they’d do it, and then check in with them regularly to make sure (It also helps if you have a prior relationship or position of authority over them, e.g. you’re their manager).
Anything else is probably not going to work out, or is unreliable at best.
(I was most recently reminded of this point from reading this comment, but really there are just so many times where I think this point is applicable).
(Position stated more strongly than I actually believe)
Assume by default that if something is missing in EA, nobody else is going to step up.
In many cases, it actually seems reasonable to believe that others will step up; e.g. because they are well-placed to do so/because it falls within a domain they have a unique competence in.
Note that, depending on what the person thinks should be done, this could range from difficult to impossible. Many EAs may lack the resources (including their own time) to act upon what may be an important project.
This meme is likely harmful because it discourages the airing of ideas where the proponent is unable to execute on it.
The counterfactual of the person not “EA shoulding” is likely not the speaker doing it themselves, but rather the speaker staying silent.
What’s wrong with “make a specific targeted suggestion for a specific person to do the thing, with an argument for why this is better than whatever else the person is doing?”, like Linch suggests?
This can still be hard, but I think the difficulty lives in the territory, and is an achievable goal for someone who follows EA Forum and pays attention to what organizations do what.
Nothing is wrong with that. In fact it is a good thing to do.
But this post seemed to discourage people from providing their thoughts regarding things that they think should be done unless they want to take personal responsibility for either personally doing it (which could entail a full-time job or multiple full-time jobs) or personally take responsibility for finding another person who they are confident will take up the task.
It would be great if the proponent of an idea or opinion had the resources and willingness to act on every idea and opinion they have, but it is helpful for people to share their thoughts even if that is not something they are able or willing to do.
I would agree with a framing of the Quick take that encouraged people to act on their should or personally find another person who they think will reliably act on it, without denigrating someone who makes an observation about a gap or need.
Speaking as someone who had an idea and acted upon it to start an organization while maintaining a full-time job to pay my own bills and for the needs of the organization, it is neither easy for most people to do a lot of things that “should be done” nor is it easy to persuade others to give up what they are doing to “own” that responsibility. In my view there is nothing wrong with making an observation of a gap or need that you think it would be cost-effective to fill, if that is all that you are able or willing to do.
I had read the “anything else is probably not going to work out, or is unreliable at best” as an insinuation that providing your thoughts regarding gaps or problems that one believes would be worth addressing is not worth doing.
Denotatively, I might agree that this assessment is correct; that is to say, it is unlikely that one comment on a matter is going to be decisive in influencing another person or institution to take the a positive action.
However, the framing does not make much sense when you consider the cost-differentials between providing an insight/comment and either persuading or otherwise causing someone to take up a proposed solution and/or taking up the project yourself. The cumulative effect of such low-cost contributions can be really substantial, and thus I would not want to discourage them.
I read (and perhaps others read it differently) this as discouraging a low cost contribution by subjecting it to an impact assessment appropriate to a higher cost contribution.
I totally agree that comments and observations will not solve problems by themselves and I would strongly encourage those who are able and willing to take the bull by the horns or find someone else who can do it.
Assume by default that if something is missing in EA, nobody else is going to step up.
I’ve been saying this a lot.
I think it’s common for newcomers to assume EA is more structured than it is. For example, they might stumble upon an addressable gap, not find any solutions but simply assume they don’t know enough about EA and that “EA higher-ups know better”.
I think at the very least, new EAs who have strong ideas about what’s missing should make a good effort to ask people who “should know”. If there’s a proposal that makes sense, and there’s no obvious reason people shouldn’t do it, it helps to ask your circles to recommend experts, read the experts’ takes and ask those experts directly if you still have question.
At the very least, you learn about a problem you care about. In some cases, the experts are working on the problem, and open to collaborators. At best, you find an interesting problem to tackle yourself.
In my limited experience, grantmakers love proposals that make them go “wow, someone should have really done that earlier”. These are usually “safe” bets with a high chance of positive impact, and can be done by EA newcomers with relevant knowledge of industry best practices.
Assume by default that if something is missing in EA, nobody else is going to step up.
The best way to get “EAs” to do something is by doing it yourself.
The second best way is to pitch a specific person to do it, with a specific, targeted ask, a quick explanation for why your proposed activity is better than that person’s nearest counterfactuals, get enthusiastic, direct affirmation that they’d do it, and then check in with them regularly to make sure (It also helps if you have a prior relationship or position of authority over them, e.g. you’re their manager).
Anything else is probably not going to work out, or is unreliable at best.
(I was most recently reminded of this point from reading this comment, but really there are just so many times where I think this point is applicable).
(Position stated more strongly than I actually believe)
See also:
EA should taboo “EA should”
In many cases, it actually seems reasonable to believe that others will step up; e.g. because they are well-placed to do so/because it falls within a domain they have a unique competence in.
I think Linch is saying that empirically, other EAs don’t seem to step up—not that there aren’t people who could step up if they wanted to.
I’m saying that there are many cases where well-placed people do step up/have stepped up.
Note that, depending on what the person thinks should be done, this could range from difficult to impossible. Many EAs may lack the resources (including their own time) to act upon what may be an important project.
This meme is likely harmful because it discourages the airing of ideas where the proponent is unable to execute on it.
The counterfactual of the person not “EA shoulding” is likely not the speaker doing it themselves, but rather the speaker staying silent.
What’s wrong with “make a specific targeted suggestion for a specific person to do the thing, with an argument for why this is better than whatever else the person is doing?”, like Linch suggests?
This can still be hard, but I think the difficulty lives in the territory, and is an achievable goal for someone who follows EA Forum and pays attention to what organizations do what.
Nothing is wrong with that. In fact it is a good thing to do.
But this post seemed to discourage people from providing their thoughts regarding things that they think should be done unless they want to take personal responsibility for either personally doing it (which could entail a full-time job or multiple full-time jobs) or personally take responsibility for finding another person who they are confident will take up the task.
It would be great if the proponent of an idea or opinion had the resources and willingness to act on every idea and opinion they have, but it is helpful for people to share their thoughts even if that is not something they are able or willing to do.
I would agree with a framing of the Quick take that encouraged people to act on their should or personally find another person who they think will reliably act on it, without denigrating someone who makes an observation about a gap or need.
Speaking as someone who had an idea and acted upon it to start an organization while maintaining a full-time job to pay my own bills and for the needs of the organization, it is neither easy for most people to do a lot of things that “should be done” nor is it easy to persuade others to give up what they are doing to “own” that responsibility. In my view there is nothing wrong with making an observation of a gap or need that you think it would be cost-effective to fill, if that is all that you are able or willing to do.
Linch didn’t say there was “something wrong” with making general observations in the hope people acted on them; he said it was very unlikely to work.
I had read the “anything else is probably not going to work out, or is unreliable at best” as an insinuation that providing your thoughts regarding gaps or problems that one believes would be worth addressing is not worth doing.
Denotatively, I might agree that this assessment is correct; that is to say, it is unlikely that one comment on a matter is going to be decisive in influencing another person or institution to take the a positive action.
However, the framing does not make much sense when you consider the cost-differentials between providing an insight/comment and either persuading or otherwise causing someone to take up a proposed solution and/or taking up the project yourself. The cumulative effect of such low-cost contributions can be really substantial, and thus I would not want to discourage them.
I read (and perhaps others read it differently) this as discouraging a low cost contribution by subjecting it to an impact assessment appropriate to a higher cost contribution.
I totally agree that comments and observations will not solve problems by themselves and I would strongly encourage those who are able and willing to take the bull by the horns or find someone else who can do it.
I’ve been saying this a lot.
I think it’s common for newcomers to assume EA is more structured than it is. For example, they might stumble upon an addressable gap, not find any solutions but simply assume they don’t know enough about EA and that “EA higher-ups know better”.
I think at the very least, new EAs who have strong ideas about what’s missing should make a good effort to ask people who “should know”. If there’s a proposal that makes sense, and there’s no obvious reason people shouldn’t do it, it helps to ask your circles to recommend experts, read the experts’ takes and ask those experts directly if you still have question.
At the very least, you learn about a problem you care about. In some cases, the experts are working on the problem, and open to collaborators. At best, you find an interesting problem to tackle yourself.
In my limited experience, grantmakers love proposals that make them go “wow, someone should have really done that earlier”. These are usually “safe” bets with a high chance of positive impact, and can be done by EA newcomers with relevant knowledge of industry best practices.