We do not know what will happen if a nuclear weapon is again detonated offensively, other than that the world would be forever changed. This is a fear shared by pretty much everyone who deals with nuclear weaponry (including recent speeches at EAG London—such as John Gower, who we met before), and even without immediate retaliation the expected probability of a large scale future exchange would rise hugely in such a world. That’s what I meant about the “all bets are off” line.
Certainly, many countries would seek to acquire weapons under this scenario (especially if the use was against a non nuclear power, which breaks a further taboo), and even if there are no further detonations in 30 days, the chances of a full scale exchange in such a world may rise by an order of magnitude.
I’m not sure that second projection is correct, and I put the mean projected additional detonations at higher levels. However, even if it is an accurate projection, I think the core point of the article holds: An offensive detonation significantly raises the probability of large exchanges, and there is a baseline risk of such an exchange today anyway → Large exchanges with thermonuclear weaponry risk nuclear winters → this is worth considering in our calculus around the expected impacts of nuclear warfare.
Yeah, I only meant to share some data as it seemed relevant, not to take a personal stance. And I think your point on more nation states acquiring nuclear weapons after a first detonation is a really good one and one that is not captured by the Metaculus questions I referred to.
Just to be clear: I think avoiding a nuclear war is important and neglected (unfortunately I am less sure about tractability but it should still be pursued). Both the recent nuclear sabre rattling of Putin, the increase in Chinese stockpiles (along with increased US-China tensions) and the withdrawal of the MacArthur foundation from funding disarmament are terrible signs and make me worry about the future. I even applied to a job here at Stockholm-based SIPRI in part because of my worries both about great power conflict and large-scale nuclear wars.
Hi Ulrik, good to hear from you again!
We do not know what will happen if a nuclear weapon is again detonated offensively, other than that the world would be forever changed. This is a fear shared by pretty much everyone who deals with nuclear weaponry (including recent speeches at EAG London—such as John Gower, who we met before), and even without immediate retaliation the expected probability of a large scale future exchange would rise hugely in such a world. That’s what I meant about the “all bets are off” line.
Certainly, many countries would seek to acquire weapons under this scenario (especially if the use was against a non nuclear power, which breaks a further taboo), and even if there are no further detonations in 30 days, the chances of a full scale exchange in such a world may rise by an order of magnitude.
I’m not sure that second projection is correct, and I put the mean projected additional detonations at higher levels. However, even if it is an accurate projection, I think the core point of the article holds: An offensive detonation significantly raises the probability of large exchanges, and there is a baseline risk of such an exchange today anyway → Large exchanges with thermonuclear weaponry risk nuclear winters → this is worth considering in our calculus around the expected impacts of nuclear warfare.
Yeah, I only meant to share some data as it seemed relevant, not to take a personal stance. And I think your point on more nation states acquiring nuclear weapons after a first detonation is a really good one and one that is not captured by the Metaculus questions I referred to.
Just to be clear: I think avoiding a nuclear war is important and neglected (unfortunately I am less sure about tractability but it should still be pursued). Both the recent nuclear sabre rattling of Putin, the increase in Chinese stockpiles (along with increased US-China tensions) and the withdrawal of the MacArthur foundation from funding disarmament are terrible signs and make me worry about the future. I even applied to a job here at Stockholm-based SIPRI in part because of my worries both about great power conflict and large-scale nuclear wars.