OP stated that L’s accusations were dismissed by the EA community.
J
Karma: 154
I might have more to say later. All I can say right now is that I am familiar with these stories.
Thank you for not only your courage to put into words what you’ve experienced, but to do it in a productive way that sparks hope for improvement. This must have taken an immense amount of effort. I want to do it justice by giving it a thorough read.
Yep I agree, that is likely the most important reason. I wanted to add more discussion to it because the insinuation that a person got a position with sex, just because they have compatible genitals, seems ludicrous to me. If any, I’ve seen men being less likely to hire talented women if they want to have sex with them, and women in tech code intentionally aromantic (hoodie, sneakers, etc) to avoid that pitfall.
This may be a spicy take, but maybe Caroline Ellison’s position at Alameda Research had more to do with her family ties than with her gender? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33575995
When you say that the author’s experience is uncommon, what evidence do you draw on? Having been an event organizer to whom some women feel safe reporting, I have heard a few reports of similar nature. That said, even one case is one too many.
To some experiences, anger is an appropriate and healthy response. When you say that this post “comes from a place of hurt”, it sounds as if you’re positioning that as a reason to criticize it. I’m worried that this raises an unreasonable standard for reports of harm. By the nature of the matter, victims have feelings about what they experienced. They should not be expected to present comprehensive analysis or perfect solutions because that’s not a job they willingly signed up for. If they have enough activation energy to report harm even though it is a charged topic for them or they fear backlash, it behooves us to honor their reports. A judgment whether to endorse or not endorse a report puts every reader in the position of judge, jury, and executioner, which I don’t think is the most helpful from a long-term view towards community health. Emotional charges can be taken at face value—as an indicator that this topic has hurt feelings, not more and not less.
Edit: grammar
I disagree—it’s more likely that this area sees serious work the more reports are made. If you are concerned about it, too, you could add your own, without telling others to be quiet and risking that the problem is overlooked or not grasped in its full extent.
The author said enough in their post and comments to resolve any confusion: they want to see this problem addressed. Your assumption that they don’t care about solving problems when they spent effort on pointing out this problem is unreasonably uncharitable.
This likely isn’t the entirety of it, but concepts from polyamory thought leadership have at times been used to initiate and steer private interactions into dynamics that have been perceived as abusive. Some of it (outside of EA) is described here: https://polyamory-metoo.com/
It’s a pretty typical failure mode to police reports of harm on their form or tone instead of engaging with the subject matter. A more successful community manages to process reports without defensiveness. The author made their point clear, thus they are contributing more towards seeing the issue addressed than anyone who wants it downvoted.
I agree with the take that there’s nothing inherently wrong in polyamory. I think what the author is highlighting is the practice of excusing shitty behavior under the guise of polyamory (the “Jedi mind tricks” they’re referring to). Impressionable people are convinced to override their intuitions about what a healthy and respectful intimate relationship looks like by people with more power that claim to have more advanced thinking about sex and pair bonding.
It’s not the author’s fault that polyamory is being co-opted this way, they’re merely the canary in the coal mine. There are further explorations outside of EA on how concepts of polyamory have been used for abuse, for example here: https://www.polyfor.us/articles/more-than-two-metoo-response
To add another data point, I have witnessed some of what has been described in here and worse. The only thing I’ve never seen is a woman getting a position while sexually involved with a man, except for monogamous couples like Bill & Melinda Gates. The opposite seems much more often the case in poly-circles, where talented women are unfairly excluded from career opportunities because male decision-makers in the orgs don’t want to get in trouble.
OP stated that L’s accusations were dismissed by the EA community. Your link doesn’t provide any proof that they’re false. So it seems like you’re proving OP right.