I agree. But the reason I agree is that I think the relevant metric of what counts as a lot of money here is not whether it is a competitive salary in an ML context, but whether it would be perceived as a lot of money in a way that could plausibly threaten Eliezer’s credibility among people who would otherwise be more disposed to support AI safety, e.g. if cited broadly. I believe the answer is that it is, and so in a way that even a sub-$250k salary would not be (despite how insanely high a salary that is by the standard of even most developed countries), and I would guess this expected effect to be bigger than the incentive benefits of guaranteeing his financial independence. For this reason, accepting this level of income struck me as unwise, though I’m happy to be persuaded otherwise.
The context of this quote, which you have removed, is discussion of the reasonableness of wages for specific people with specific skills. Since neither Nate nor Eliezer’s counterfactual is earning the median global wage, your statistic seems irrelevant.
One should stick to the original point that raised the question about salary.
Is $600K a lot of money for most people and does EY hurt his cause by accepting this much? (Perhaps, but not the original issue)
Does EY earning $600K mean he’s benefitting substantially from maintaining his position on AI safety? E.g. if he was more pro AI development, would this hurt him financially? (Very unlikely IMO, and that was the context Thomas was responding to)
On a global scale I agree. My point is more that due to the salary standards in the industry, Eliezer isn’t necessarily out of line in drawing $600k, and it’s probably not much more than he could earn elsewhere; therefore the financial incentive is fairly weak compared to that of Mechanize or other AI capabilities companies.
Thanks for the reply. I agree with your specific point but I think it’s worth being more careful with your phrasing. How much we earn is an ethically-charged thing, and it’s not a good thing if EA’s relationship with AI companies gives us a permission structure to lose sight of this.
Edit: to be clear, I agree that “it’s probably not much more than he could earn elsewhere” but disagree that “Eliezer isn’t necessarily out of line in drawing $600k”
This is false.
I agree. But the reason I agree is that I think the relevant metric of what counts as a lot of money here is not whether it is a competitive salary in an ML context, but whether it would be perceived as a lot of money in a way that could plausibly threaten Eliezer’s credibility among people who would otherwise be more disposed to support AI safety, e.g. if cited broadly. I believe the answer is that it is, and so in a way that even a sub-$250k salary would not be (despite how insanely high a salary that is by the standard of even most developed countries), and I would guess this expected effect to be bigger than the incentive benefits of guaranteeing his financial independence. For this reason, accepting this level of income struck me as unwise, though I’m happy to be persuaded otherwise.
Thanks for the good point, Paul. I tend to agree.
The context of this quote, which you have removed, is discussion of the reasonableness of wages for specific people with specific skills. Since neither Nate nor Eliezer’s counterfactual is earning the median global wage, your statistic seems irrelevant.
What do you think their counterfactual is? I don’t think any of what they’ve been doing is really transferable.
One should stick to the original point that raised the question about salary.
Is $600K a lot of money for most people and does EY hurt his cause by accepting this much? (Perhaps, but not the original issue)
Does EY earning $600K mean he’s benefitting substantially from maintaining his position on AI safety? E.g. if he was more pro AI development, would this hurt him financially? (Very unlikely IMO, and that was the context Thomas was responding to)
On a global scale I agree. My point is more that due to the salary standards in the industry, Eliezer isn’t necessarily out of line in drawing $600k, and it’s probably not much more than he could earn elsewhere; therefore the financial incentive is fairly weak compared to that of Mechanize or other AI capabilities companies.
Thanks for the reply. I agree with your specific point but I think it’s worth being more careful with your phrasing. How much we earn is an ethically-charged thing, and it’s not a good thing if EA’s relationship with AI companies gives us a permission structure to lose sight of this.
Edit: to be clear, I agree that “it’s probably not much more than he could earn elsewhere” but disagree that “Eliezer isn’t necessarily out of line in drawing $600k”
It’s true Mechanize are trying to hire him for 650k...