My reasons for being vegan have little to do with the direct negative effects of factory farming. They are in roughly descending order of importance.
A constant reminder to myself that non-human animals matter. My current day-to-day activities give nearly no reason to think about the fact that non-human animals have moral worth. This is my 2-5 times per day reminder of this fact.
Reduction of cognitive dissonance. It took about a year of being vegan to begin to appreciate, viscerally, that animals had moral worth. Itâs hard to quantify this but it is tough to think that animals have moral worth when you eat them a few times a day. This has flow-through effects on donations, cause prioritization, etc.
The effect it has on others. Iâm not a pushy vegan at all. I hardly tell people but every now and then people notice and ask questions about it.
Solidarity with non-EAA animal welfare people. For better or worse, outside of EA, this seems to be a ticket to entry to be considered taking the issue seriously. I want to be able to convince them to donate to THL over a pet shelter and to SWP over dog rescue charities and the the EA AWF over Pets for Vets. They are more likely to listen to me when they see me as one of them who just happens to be doing the math.
Reducing the daily suffering that I cause. Itâs still something even though it pales in comparison to my yearly donations but it is me living in accordance with my values and is causing less suffering than I would otherwise.
I donât know man, virtue signaling to non-vegans and vegans that you care about animals can be done simply by telling people you donate 10% of your money to animal welfare. It doesnât take much more than that. Utilitarianism can be explained.
As for lowering cognitive dissonance, this is an extremely person to person thing. I would never prescribe veganism to an EA with this reasoning. And this this was a common reason, why havenât I also been told to have a pet/âanimal companion to increase how much moral worth I give animals?
And reducing daily suffering that you cause can also be done better with an extra 10 cents or so. Wouldnât this be more in accordance with your values? Surely 10 cents is also cheaper than veganism.
I listed in descending order of importance. I might be confused for one of those âhyper rationalistâ types in many instances. I think rationalist undervalue the cognitive dissonance. In my experience, a lot of rationalists just donât value non human animals. Even rationalists behave in a much more âvibesâ based way than theyâd have you believe. It really is hard to hold in your head both âitâs okay to eat animalsâ and âwe can avert tremendous amounts of suffering to hundreds of animals per dollar and have a moral compulsion to do soâ.
I also wouldnât call what I do virtue signaling. I never forthright tell people and I live in a very conservative part of the world.
Two of your reasons to go vegan involve getting to tell others you are vegan. I find this pretty dishonest because I assume you arenât telling them this.
Itâs not about telling others Iâm vegan. Itâs about telling them that I think non human animals are worthy of moral consideration. I also tell people that I donate to animal welfare charities and even which ones.
I donât think that virtue signaling by telling most people you donate 10 percent would with week to noon vegans would work well. Most of my friends would consider me a hypocrite for doing that, and longer explanations wouldnât work for many.
Utilitarianism can be explained, but even after that explanation many would consider eating meat and offsetting hypocritical, even if it might be virtuous.
The point of the virtue signaling is the signaling, not the virtue and the cleanest and easiest way to do that in many circles might be going vegan.
So if they ask you, âwhy are you vegan?â, your honest answer would be âbecause I need you to accept me as a non-hypocrite.â????? I donât think vegans would give you any extra consideration if they knew this was your reasoning. Any other reason you give would be dishonest and misleading.
Great points, Marcus! I do not know whether following a plant-based diet directly benefits or harms animals due to effects on wild animals, but I think this mostly only undermines your 5th reason. Another important reason for me is that I expect a whole-food plant-based diet to be cheaper and healthier, thus increasing future earnings, and donations in expectation.
My reasons for being vegan have little to do with the direct negative effects of factory farming. They are in roughly descending order of importance.
A constant reminder to myself that non-human animals matter. My current day-to-day activities give nearly no reason to think about the fact that non-human animals have moral worth. This is my 2-5 times per day reminder of this fact.
Reduction of cognitive dissonance. It took about a year of being vegan to begin to appreciate, viscerally, that animals had moral worth. Itâs hard to quantify this but it is tough to think that animals have moral worth when you eat them a few times a day. This has flow-through effects on donations, cause prioritization, etc.
The effect it has on others. Iâm not a pushy vegan at all. I hardly tell people but every now and then people notice and ask questions about it.
Solidarity with non-EAA animal welfare people. For better or worse, outside of EA, this seems to be a ticket to entry to be considered taking the issue seriously. I want to be able to convince them to donate to THL over a pet shelter and to SWP over dog rescue charities and the the EA AWF over Pets for Vets. They are more likely to listen to me when they see me as one of them who just happens to be doing the math.
Reducing the daily suffering that I cause. Itâs still something even though it pales in comparison to my yearly donations but it is me living in accordance with my values and is causing less suffering than I would otherwise.
I donât know man, virtue signaling to non-vegans and vegans that you care about animals can be done simply by telling people you donate 10% of your money to animal welfare. It doesnât take much more than that. Utilitarianism can be explained.
As for lowering cognitive dissonance, this is an extremely person to person thing. I would never prescribe veganism to an EA with this reasoning. And this this was a common reason, why havenât I also been told to have a pet/âanimal companion to increase how much moral worth I give animals?
And reducing daily suffering that you cause can also be done better with an extra 10 cents or so. Wouldnât this be more in accordance with your values? Surely 10 cents is also cheaper than veganism.
Sorry if I sound attacking.
I listed in descending order of importance. I might be confused for one of those âhyper rationalistâ types in many instances. I think rationalist undervalue the cognitive dissonance. In my experience, a lot of rationalists just donât value non human animals. Even rationalists behave in a much more âvibesâ based way than theyâd have you believe. It really is hard to hold in your head both âitâs okay to eat animalsâ and âwe can avert tremendous amounts of suffering to hundreds of animals per dollar and have a moral compulsion to do soâ.
I also wouldnât call what I do virtue signaling. I never forthright tell people and I live in a very conservative part of the world.
Two of your reasons to go vegan involve getting to tell others you are vegan. I find this pretty dishonest because I assume you arenât telling them this.
Itâs not about telling others Iâm vegan. Itâs about telling them that I think non human animals are worthy of moral consideration. I also tell people that I donate to animal welfare charities and even which ones.
I donât think that virtue signaling by telling most people you donate 10 percent would with week to noon vegans would work well. Most of my friends would consider me a hypocrite for doing that, and longer explanations wouldnât work for many.
Utilitarianism can be explained, but even after that explanation many would consider eating meat and offsetting hypocritical, even if it might be virtuous.
The point of the virtue signaling is the signaling, not the virtue and the cleanest and easiest way to do that in many circles might be going vegan.
So if they ask you, âwhy are you vegan?â, your honest answer would be âbecause I need you to accept me as a non-hypocrite.â????? I donât think vegans would give you any extra consideration if they knew this was your reasoning. Any other reason you give would be dishonest and misleading.
Great points, Marcus! I do not know whether following a plant-based diet directly benefits or harms animals due to effects on wild animals, but I think this mostly only undermines your 5th reason. Another important reason for me is that I expect a whole-food plant-based diet to be cheaper and healthier, thus increasing future earnings, and donations in expectation.